From what I've heard, most gun owners are conservatives.
I'm a liberal and an environmentalist, planning to become a Wildlife Biologist.
The only thing I can see is making automatic weapons illegal.
Most of the guns used in crimes are illegally obtained, anyway...
My question is... What is people's big problem with gun control?
Special courses and licenses would be much better to determine if a shooter is planning on blowing someone away with it than a blind $200 tax. Maybe I should write to Congress and suggest a revision of the laws...
Hmm... The NRA brings up some good points, but what irritates me is the lack of comprimise. They see things as black and white.
...(Another 4 years of Bush's policies? HELL NO.), but since Obama was elected, I'll see if he keeps his promise of change.
After all, people should not fear their government, but a government should fear its people.
The feel I get from reading the NRA page is that they're pretty much saying "No laws barring ownership of guns, period."
Point 18:
"The problem with mandatory gun safety training is that it can so easily be used to interfere with someone's choice to own a firearm. "Safety" training can be used improperly to infringe on the right to keep and bear arms."
Just like that. They're SO paranoid that ANY law about guns are taking away thier rights. It's ridiculous.
JWC, I agree with everything you said except the part what you call yourself. You don't sound very liberal to me. You sound like a Libertarian.
Classical liberalism (also known as traditional liberalism, laissez-faire liberalism, market liberalism or, outside the United States, simply liberalism) is a doctrine stressing individual freedom and limited government. This includes the importance of human rationality, individual property rights, natural rights, the protection of civil liberties, individual freedom from restraint, constitutional limitation of government, free markets, and a gold standard to place fiscal constraints on government as exemplified in the writings of John Locke, Adam Smith, David Hume, David Ricardo, Voltaire, Montesquieu and others. As such, it is the fusion of economic liberalism with political liberalism of the late 18th and 19th centuries. The "normative core" of classical liberalism is the idea that laissez-faire economics will bring about a spontaneous order or invisible hand that benefits the society, though it does not necessarily oppose the state's provision of some basic public goods with what constitutes public goods being seen as very limited. The qualification classical was applied retroactively to distinguish it from more recent, 20th-century conceptions of liberalism and its related movements, such as social liberalism, which promotes a more interventionist role for the state in economic matters.
Ludwig von Mises, Friedrich Hayek, and Milton Friedman, are credited with influencing a revival of classical liberalism in the twentieth century after it fell out of favor beginning in the late nineteenth century and much of the twentieth century. In relation to economic issues, this revival is sometimes referred to, mainly by its opponents, as "neoliberalism". The German "ordoliberalism" has a whole different meaning, since the likes of Alexander Rüstow and Wilhelm Röpke have advocated a more interventionist state, as opposed to laissez-faire liberals. Classical liberalism has many aspects in common with modern libertarianism, with the terms being used almost interchangeably by those who support limited government.
I don't see how teaching someone the proper safety procedures regarding firearms is going to infringe on anyone's rights. If anything, it'll make them more cautious shooters and reduce the number of accidents by novice shooters.
Have you forgotten that just a few short months ago, the Constitutional interpretation that Second Amendment in the Bill of Rights guaranteed the right to bear arms only as it pertained to "a well-regulated militia" (ie, government regulated militia) was struck down by a 5 to 4 vote? One Supreme Court Justice appointment to a liberal judge who wants gun control is all it will take to overturn the 2nd amendment without a shot being fired, so to speak. And then the Constitution be D********ed, as it won't be what the Constitution says, but instead, what the liberal activist judges on the Supreme Court say it says.
I certainly don't have a very good feeling about the federal justices Obama and the Democratic majority are likely to appoint en mass in just the next few months. If you are an American who believes in the 2nd amendment and the right of individual citizens to bear arms, better support the NRA, irrespective of any other political position.
When the Constitution was written, everyone had muzzle-loading muskets! The tech of the day was very low, like a gunpowder BB gun. I don't know if the framers had today's society in mind. It was written when we just became a country, and they were thinking about what things they didn't like about England and how not to become them...In the time, we were fighting for freedom, so they wanted to make sure that if someone tried to attack them, everyone was ready. I believe that gun ownership IS an individual right, but the intent of the framers is lost in today's society. We don't need the Minutemen anymore.
I speak out strongly against Prop 8 and directly quote the Constitution, for example, but that's as far as I'll go on that topic in this thread.
You're a bit off there. The part about a free state went like this: "A well-regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free state," meaning that the militia IS armed readiness against an invasion or threat.
Hermie - 12/24/2008 1:39 AM
From what I've heard, most gun owners are conservatives. I'm a liberal and an environmentalist, planning to become a Wildlife Biologist. And yet.. I've fallen in love with a machine that throws projectiles at fast speeds and puts holes in things. :P
I keep hearing about how Obama might take your guns away and all that, but I really think some people are just paranoid. Gun ownership is a protected right. I REALLY doubt Obama is going to do anything to take away people's guns.
The only thing I can see is making automatic weapons illegal. I see no reason why people need automatic weapons. They're pretty pointless for hunting... But they do look cool. (Of course, wants and needs are two different things.) I'm all for someone having an automatic weapon with a special permit and a certificate from a saftey course.
Most of the guns used in crimes are illegally obtained, anyway...
My question is... What is people's big problem with gun control? You can still get your gun, but it just takes a while. I'm not going to mind a 2 week waiting period. It'll just make finally getting it that much more enjoyable. I'm not seeing what the fuss is all about. Someone care to explain? And please, keep a level, mature head.
Hermie - 12/26/2008 12:51 PM
Actually.. After reading more, it's BOTH. The first half is readiness against invasion/threats, and the second is protecting the right of the people to bear arms...But I guess we'll have to agree to disagree there.
MEHavey - 12/27/2008 11:02 AM
 If you read the Federalist Papers (whose publication was deliberately meant to outline limitations on centralized gov't, and gto et the states to ratify the Constitution), the Second Amendment was specifially aimed at the The People retaining the ability to organize and resist/take down any attempt at tyranical gov't.
It was not about hunting, self defense, target shooting or collecting -- as the Nancy Pelosi's of the world would like to make you believe -- it was about the power to violently revolt against unjust rule.
That is terrifying to the Power Brokers of today, and they desparately want to downplay any aspect of that capability.
Hermie - 2/15/2009 2:58 PM Republicans need to follow that as well... Give them an inch to invade personal lives by, say, overturning Roe V. Wade, they'll go to extremes and invade your bedrooms and private lives further.If you think that the goal of Republicans(more so than Dems) is to invade your private life you are wrong. "patriot act" was ridiculous, ill give ya that. 99.9% of abortions are pure unadulterated murder. You think its ok? See ya in hell. Ill probably be there too but not for supporting the murder of God's children. The "paranoia" you refer to is actually well grounded fear of government control. You spout things like "well, i think they should "round up illegal distribution of firearms"" Thats what the ATF was supposed to do but they would much rather kill innocents and harass citizens. (google) To say the founding fathers wrote the Constitution specifically for their time in history without thinking into the future is ignorant and a slap in the face to those who designed and those who now protect your freedoms. "obama's not comin after our guns.." jesus kid, what kool aide party did you stumble out of?