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General Discussion To Gateway To Airguns => China Gate => : geewhiz380 February 04, 2010, 02:23:40 AM
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i want to know cause im a springer person and love my powerful and accurate springers soon im getting the b25.22 baboo stock ,i have the b26,b30,qb78d tuned now its between the b40 or tf89 but i have a 350m.22 from phil b that is a excellent airrifle and phil had it transformed into a bazooka sort of speak ..so family what is your choice......jorgie porgie
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Jorge, with AGs and other things, I guess you always want what you don't have. (http://../jscripts/tiny_mce/plugins/emotions/images/smiley-laughing.gif)
I have a TF89 in .22. I did a home tune/lubebefore I sent it to Gene for him to massage also. It is one HARD hitting gun. My target backstop is 5/8" pressboard and I had to double it to stop the CPHP rounds. It definately punched through one layer at 25 yards. And VERY accurate too. It will stack them as long as you master the holdfor this power house.
I do not own a 350M but from all I've read about them, I may have to just squeeze the wallet and get one. I read the craftsmanshipis top of the line and makes a world of difference in the way they shoot compared to others. I would really like to try one to see. The .22 TF89 is a real huntingAG and a great value for the price.
Happy Shooting!!!!
Dave
(http://../jscripts/tiny_mce/plugins/emotions/images/smiley-cool.gif)
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Jorge,,,, I have a .22 TF-89 and a .22 350 Magnum, both guns are stock.
Both of them are fine shooting rifles, very smooth shooting, very accurate and extremely hard hitting. That being said though I have to tell you that my 350 definitely has the edge when it comes to power and overall quality.
The appearance, function and quality on my 89 is very good and she's a handsome looking rifle that shoots in the in the low to mid 800's, depending on pellet, and is very accurate. In short, I think the 89 is a super value for someone looking for a good, solid, hard hitting hunting rifle and I'm glad I own one , but at the same time in my opinion the 350 is definitely a step up in all categories. As for accuracy..... my 350 is more accurate than my 89, not by much but the difference is there. Of course that could be because my 89 tends to be a bit hold sensitive and my 350 isn't. Perhaps a tune on the 89 would close the distance in accuracy and power, I don't know.... perhaps one of these days I'll ship it to Gene and I'll find out :)
If I could only buy one I'd get the 350 every time......
Of course this is how I feel about my guns.... others may differ with me and of course that's fine :)
Jeff
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I myself own the tf89 but I do not own the 350. All I can say about the 89 is the she's great to shoot, she's stock and I can manage to pull off dime size groups at 35 yards with open sights if I do my part. What a great gun with a beautiful stock might I add. She's a keeper in my book.
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everthingsaid has help me with my decsion since i have the 350m.22 tuned already and seasoned i,ll get the b40.22 and that will be the tenth airrifle ill get for awhile .i bought a tf97.22 and even though i wanted it to hit in the 700,s but like i was told its not made for fps like that but no doubt its a very accurate airrifle at 20yds the stack up that the pellets fall out the wood from hitting each other ,im very impressed with this shooter andy wong sold me a great rifle and gave me a great price and scope so i have to thank him for his honesty ...thanks andy wong better known as lawspawn....from a friend jorge lopez...God bless us all from my heart ...
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why not a b28?
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You deprive yourself of knowing what the real thing is like :)
I'd get a 28 as a second gun :)
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I want to read the rest of this thread after I respond, so I may be a little repetitive to what is already here....
I've owned several TF89s (.177, .22, and a Walther Force 1000 -- same gun), and a RWS 350. I had both the TF89s tuned, and I'll be doing the Walther myself. I frankly didn't like the 350 much. It was just a bit more powerful than the TF89s, but one thing I was not impressed by was the accuracy. I was shooting .7 groups at 10 yards. Some will say that is because the rifle is hold sensitive and that it was my fault, and to an extent I'll agree with that... but I also don't want to have to baby a gun. It was hard cocking and brutal on scopes and mounts. Not long after I bought the RWS350, I got a Cometa Fusion, and the shots were so accurate I thought I was misfiring -- looked for the pellets stuck in the barrel, but they weren't there. I was using the same hold -- and I was the same shooter. Not long after I traded the 350 for a 48. I don't miss the 350. I just got a Cometa Fenix in .177, and prefer that.
My TF89s are great. Gene tuned and I shoot .2 groups with them at 10 yards. The .22 is slightly more accurate and a bit more powerful. I was considering a B40, or TX200, but I think the underlever I really want is the BSA Goldstar 10-shot repeater. I have the TF97 as my only underlever, and it is fine but certainly lacks punch. Way easy to cock, though!
If you have to have one of the hardest hitting, maybe you need the 350... but I think there are better guns for less, and you named several of them. I think some of the Euro-speak about quality is overdone. My guess is you enjoy the TF89 a lot and can get a tune and rifle for the same price as an untuned 350.
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I've got to say that my 89 is not quite as accurate and not quite as powerful. However they both are accurate and both hit hard! I just did a lube tune to my 89 and it is shooting better. My 350 is a dream to shoot but it wasn't at first. It was a BEAR (but so was the TF89).
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get a MM tuned 28. you wont be sorry
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Jorge my brother i have a Gene tuned TF89 in .22 and im here to tell you that its a powerhouse! and mine is very very accurate and not hold sensitive at all now, it was a little bit before Gene worked his magic on it, but now its smooth as can be, i dont own a 350, i didnt see the need for one after getting my TF89, id rather have the extra coin to put towards another gun myself, After reading Charlies opinion of the Crosman NPSS guns i believe that will be my next gun, but im in the middle of my TF78 gold project right now, my MMB26 and Gene turbo tunedTF89 really take care of all my airgun needs but airguns are like potato chips you cant have just one lol
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First off you really need to think about accuracy and shootability not power, you dont need a rifle 800+fps to punch paper at 10 or 20 yds IMO that's going over board, and is a waist! If your a hunter and hunt game bigger than wabbit's I can see using a .22cal rifle in 800+ foot range if your gonna be shooting 50yds or more! I've shot squirei's at 80yds w/ a HW95 .22cal shootin 640fps and hit them in the boiler room and ya they ran but only a few feet before they droped dead and no the pellet didn't pass thru them nor does it pass thru crow's at 35 or 40yds but kill's them dead as a door nail, shot placement is the key! I think alot of guy underestimate the power of airgun's, unless your a power junkie and just gotta have it! IMO the 350mag's are a poor design by RWS it just doesn't work well, these are worst recoiling rifle's I've ever shot and I've owned several of them thinkin ya I could get use to them and after thousand's of pellet's nothin changed thier still a jack hammer being fired on your shoulder and in .22cal for no more power than they produce IMO thier not worth it. I can buy 2 89's and be a whole lot happier, yes the 89's need a little work and thier not as elegant as an RWS but one thing is for sure it ain't gonna kick like a mule and tuned only get's better and shoot's as fast and hard as the 350 and as accurate w/ the right pellet's and a whole lot more shootable due to the recoil issues of the 350mag which is due to the length of the compression tube and travel time of the piston, this RWS design is just not efficient ya it creat's power but not comfortable power that's user friendly where as the 89's power plant is a whole lot more user friendly which lead's to better shootability! IMO The best Rifle's RWS make's right now for power and shootability is the M48 and 460mag in .22cal.
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its been awhile since i have written on this topic but i had to today cause i have the 350m.22 and its a powerful accurate airrifle and shorterned barrel by timmy and its a dream to shoot so with that said my son bought a b25.22 bamboo stock when it came out however he couldnt wait cause i just had gotten the box when i fell in the hospital but he did put about 200 pellets in her in three days and my friend who is into higher spending airrifles he was amazed at the power and accuratecy its a sniper stock better grip for smaller hands ,he said the cycle is great the trigger is very decent and could be left alone cause it will get better but as far as accuratecy he loved it he shot at 35yds and stack them with no problem being new i was surprised my next plan should be the remington npss .22 or .177 but who ever is thinkin about a bamboo stock it worth it and its the same weight as far as the synthetic stock goes,the wood one the shark fin one i think they all weigh the same i would have thought that it was going to weigh less but it didnt so i let my friend who has the b25.22 synthetic stock feel my sons and said a slight difference by not by much however im not mad just happy to know my son made a good desicion without my help that means hes learning and thats a plus and he is learning from the best experinced friends i have which r from 27years old to 62 years old the shoots pcps all day .as far as a pcp im gonna get a disco that my son bought me and took it to maine wow a distant gift i hope my hands could reach that far so i could shoot it .jorge..God bless us all from my heart ...
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Jorge, I have never shot a TF-98 rifle so I can't give a fare comparison betwen them and the 350's. What I can offer is my opinion of the 350's,...or in my case, the B-28 clones. As many of you know, I have two. one in .177, and .22. After shooting both of them and learning the nuances and characteristics of this styl and design of rifle,...I have nothing but praise for them. One poster on this thread feels that the 350's are a poorly designned rifle,...and that's ok and I respect his opinion,...but to me, nothing could be further from the truth. I think the 350's are a well designned and very efficient rifle. They are well balanced rifles if held correctly, and are rather easy to cock and shoot extremely accurately,....once you've mastered them,...and that is not an over-night learned lesson. It takes alot of practice, diligence, and above all patience in not only the rifle, but in youself as well. I admit mine were both tuned by MM,...and I've re-worked the both of them. Many folks think they are heavy,....and even "barrel heavy", but I don't think this is the case at all, but because of incorrect hold of the weapon, any one can see why such statements would be made. The 350/B-28's are "long guns", not heavy rifles. Want a heavy rifle,...pick up a RX-2 and shoot it for an afternoon., then grab a 350 and you'll think you've picked up a Crosman Quest!!!!!
On the power scale compared to the TF-98. I don't know, but when shooting my .177 B-28, anything under the 10.2 JSB heavies shoot SS, and POI rises in a shot-gun pattern!!! 8.8 CroMags can hold the best SS groups of about 1 1/2" off-hand at 25 yards, but the groups shrink alot with the JSB's and Kodiak/Baracudas. Personally I hate it when It shoots SS. Just not a good recipe for rifle/spring longevity. But I know it definatly has the juice and accuracy if the power is harnessed with an apropriate weight pellet. The .22 B-28 is simply a joy to shoot, and is still my fav gun to hunt with. Smooth in every facet, and more accurate than the nut behind the trigger.
I bought a Chroney about a year ago,...but it's been awhile since I did any velocity checks,....and to be honest with you,...I could care less how fast they shoot. The chroney is more or less a tool for diagnostic checks,....and is for the most part collecting dust in my shop!!!
That's my two cents on the 350's/B-28's, and agree with me or not, they are fine rifles. And if you dis-agree with me, that's ok too because we're all entitled to our own opinions, and and I respect others ops as well!!! Ain't BB-Guns Cool?!?!?!? LOL's, Thomas
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The 350 is a well-designed rifle, certainly. I was not the one that said it was bad, but that in considering the RWS350 and TF89 side by side, the TF89 was better to shoot. It makes me wonder why I'd pay more than twice as much for a 350. I did, and then had trouble re-selling it. I ended up trading for an older RWS48. So many people end up wanting to cut down the barrel on the RWS350 because the gun is too long and front heavy -- and then I wonder why they want it in the first place as cutting the barrel makes it harder to cock and less powerful. If you don't want the power in the first place, get something shorter, easier to cock, better balanced and more accurate...the TF89. Another thing that bothers me is that 350 owners all say how it is very hold sensitive. Well, a tuned TF89 is not (maybe out of the box, but not so much as the 350). And even tuned the TF89 is $100 less.
I had both rifles and wanted a reason to justify keeping the RWS350. I couldn't find it. Nice rifle, sure...no money 'wasted'. But be sure it is what you need... and don't buy it to modify it so it is more like the TF89 and pay for a more expensive rifle -- ask yourself the right questions. With so many rifles on the market, likely the one you want is around somewhere! The actual difference in FPS was about 80 fps in my side-by-side tests. I have 3 TF89s (.177, .22, and one .177 that is a project gun), and the cost was as much as I paid for one RWS350.
The biggest objection I hear about the TF89 is "made in China". Well, that may have been a badge of dishonor 3 years ago or more... but my guess is most who speak against them haven't shot one -- or did when they were still not so well refined.
I'd get a Cometa Fusion before either. but that one fits my quest for style, power, smoothness, accuracy, and balance.
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I agree with Thomas..... I think the 350 is an outstanding rifle and hunter. My .22 350 is a joy to shoot and has the accuracy and power I want for hunting. I personally don't find the 350 hold sensitive or hard to shoot accurately, far from it, I find it very easy to shoot accurately. Is it long ? Yes. Is it heavy ? Yes , but I don't have a problem with either and find the rifle comfortable to shoot. I also own a .22 TF-89. My TF-89 is accurate and very powerful and a great hunting rifle, but I'd choose the 350 over the 89 for power, accuracy and overall quality every time. Did my 350 cost more than my 89 ? Sure did,, but it was worth every penny to me.
These are of course my opinions of my guns. I realize others may have a different opinion but that's OK because we're all entitled to our own likes and dislikes. :)
Jeff
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I own a 350 Pro Compact in .22 and that rifle is most definately a jack- hammer to shoot....... I guess I can be a "power junkie" at times but I have to agree with Mark611 and say that the power is wasted on punching paper. Yes the rifle can be quite challenging to shoot, but once mastered can be very, very accurate (make sure you work out though, they are a heavy rifle scoped up). I love my 350 and can't imagine getting rid of the powerhouse........now I gotta tear the beast down again and re-lube it.....didn't do such a hot job last time apparently.....stinkin thing is deiseling like crazy and is on the verge of getting detonation...starting to crack just a little too loudly...........
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I shot both the TF 89 today and the 350 just goofing around. Just my honest opinion, I think the 350 is worth the money. It is smoother, more accurate, and is prettier :) However, the accurate and the power are so close that I wouldn't turn my back on my 89 either.
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I favor the TF-89 over the RWS -350.. I like certain models of Diana/RWS but the 350 is not one of them..:) Yes I know the TF-89 is a Chinese gun but the trigger and shooting cycle after a tune has got the edge on an RWS 350 for sure.. JMO
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Good to hear that out of your mouth Gene! Sometimes I wonder if there is something obvious I missed in the 350. You help make those TF89s SWEET with your tunes. Not a slight on RWS guns, as you say, and I have two RWS guns that I think have more potential (that 48 I traded for will be nice when I'm done with it, and I've a Cometa Fenix that is really an RWS 94). Just never warmed to the RWS 350.
I have 4 Gene-tuned guns. Don't go missing out on THAT experience!
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i have had my 350m.22 for about 8 months and its a great rifle however i also have a b30.22that is a homerun everytime and i use iron sites out to 30yds and homerun but with the rws350m.22 it take me two or three shots to hit it cause i dont use it as much as i should but it is a favorite and i didnt pay much and got a complete package from phil b and his 350 was on point and tuned with maccari of everthing u could think of thats why i bought it, but as for the b30.22 and b26.177and b25.22 bamboo which r chinese airrifles credit has to be given to them for the improvement that has been made with them so china u will have two thumbs up from me .im a springer person cause i have master there hold and gotten used to there sound ,recoil,trigger and mostly price but to me it less expensive and space for other things in need for the arsenal ,german rifles r excellent for shootin but it more like a collective type of airgun where as the chinese airguns u could go anywhere with them without worring how much u paid,but a pcp is in order for me especially an affordable one or even a trade ...thanks for sharing guys ..God bless us all and our family as well ...from a friend jorgie porgie