GTA
General Discussion To Gateway To Airguns => Hunting Gate => : atchman2 March 03, 2010, 11:29:37 AM
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Dick's has a Remington 700 ADL .223 in stock with the bull barrel. That is perfect for coyotes and prairie dogs. My question is can I use it for deer? Remember in TN about the longest shot you will take is a hundred yards. I'd guess it the average is actually air gun range.
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Randy,,, I would first check with the hunting regs for your state and see if that caliber is in fact legal. If it is then of course you could use it if you feel it's adequate for the job. It's legal to use a .223 in NY for deer but I don't anyone who uses that caliber. I do know a farmer upstate who has been using a .222 bolt action for deer as long as I can remember and he gets his deer every year. I should add though that he's an exceptional shot with that rifle and can put the bullet right where he wants it even at long range. My personal feeling is that it's a little "light" for deer but others may feel differently. I'm sure others will chime in with their feelings.
Jeff
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Any centerfire rifle is legal in TN.
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Well, then it's legal for sure :) Just a matter now of deciding if you want to use it for deer. I would imagine at the distances you're talking about the caliber should be capable of taking down a deer cleanly with a good shot, but then again I'm the first to admit I'm no ballistics expert. My favorite rifle for deer hunting is chambered for .243 Winchester. I use the the 100 grain for deer and 80 grain for my varmint hunting. The rifle is an awesome varmint caliber and does a fantastic job during deer season. Anyway, I'm sure one of the other members who have more knowledge on the topic will chime in.
Jeff
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Alot of guys around here have either a .223 and 22-250 for Woodchucks and Coyotes, but I've yet to meet any that would use them for deer, even at close range.
When our country changed to allow rifle a number of years ago, I asked around about using my .223, but couldn't find anyone who would say it was a good way to go. All of them, like Jeff brought up, said shot placement with a bullet that small and light is too critical,.... and the deer don't always give you the optimum angle for critical shots.
Not sure how big your deer get, but Black Hills has a very good 60 gr soft point if your gonna try it.
Paul.
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I have shot about ten deer with my mini 14 its a .223 all were clean kills, one thing is you have to shoot them behind the shoulder. If you hit them in the shoulder you will not get good penetration. Also If its a varmit rifle it will have around a 1 to 12 inch twist which stabilizes the light bullets but not the heavyer bullets you will need to shoot to hunt deer. Which require a 1 to 9 inch or faster.
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Do you know the rate of twist for the Rem? If 1:12, then you will want to stay with 60 grain or lighter -- which means you will be somewhat limited. On the other hand, with twist rates of 1:9, you can easily stabilize heavier bullet weights up to 75 or 80 grains and have several bullet options that would be more appropriate for deer. Do you plan to reload or shoot factory loads? Not a deer hunter myself, but I wager I could bring down a deer with my CZ-527 Varmint (1:12) without too much trouble. I would go with a 55gr BTHP or soft nose bullet rather than 55 gr FMJ, though.
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theres alot of people in missouri that use 223 for deer hunting and in fact the 204 too.my buddies went to oklahoma this past weekend and were shooting hogs with 223 and 204.everyone came back with a hog or two.i dont see why it wouldnt work plus shells are cheaper.
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Looks like all Remington .223 are a 12 twist.
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The tactical models have 1 in 9 inch twist.
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Didn't know that. I can't find that model on their website. They say that they only run the ADLs for the box stores.
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I know someone who has shot deer with the .223. Like was said before, shot placment is critcal. I think if you stick to shots you would only take with a bow, it would be just fine. Don't aim for bone. Of course you can shoot farther. However, if you have something more suitable for deer i would use it. A .243 would be great. My granpda hunts with one when we go to the southern tier. Where i live it's shotgun or muzzleloader only. I would use a slug gun before a .223. My 20 gauge 870 dumps them.
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I'm thinking of going ahead and getting the .223.
I'm a salesman and I'm hoping for another 'home run" sale to get my deer gun. :) I have a bow already so I can always use that. My friend Jim has already told me I can use his 30-30.
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A .223 is not legal in California to take deer, and probably not in most western states. I think it is a little light for taking deer. Can it take a deer? Probably, within a certain range. I would go with a .243 at the very least.
What other calibers are being offered in that model?
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Randy.
The Savage .223's are 1-9 twist, and known for being extreamly accurate right out of the box. If your not going to get into hand loading, groups under an inch at 100 yards with off the shelf ammo is the norm for a Savage. If you do, they get scary accurate.
My model 11 doesn't have the newer, much better, two stage trigger and it will shoot 3/4 inch groups all day with Black Hills 50 grain V-max. 9/16 groups with Black Hills 60 gr Soft points and the Rem UMC 55 gr Soft points are easy to do. Savages have the twist to handle the heavy bullets, but are still quite accurate with the lighter varmint bullets.
And they leave more money in your pocket to put some realy good glass on it.
http://www.savagearms.com/
Paul.
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I'll stop by Bass Pro Shops today on the way back from Morristown and take a look there. The Rem 700 ADL .223 has the camo stock, and a scope included. It also has the bull varmint barrel. They want $419 for it. If they took trades, I trade in my 9 mm pistol.
Tonight I'm meeting a local predator hunter for coffee to see if we can stand each other. He likes to film stuff too, so I'm hoping this will be someone to help me out with my TV show idea.
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Randy, on paper a .223, .22-250, etc, will deliver enough fpe to qualify as a deer killer.And as you already know it's legal to do so in TN. The problem you'll have is in bullet selection. Thin skinned, high velocity .22 centerfires might not have the structural integrity to stay together while punching the hole in deer sized animals. In the hands of an expert rifleman, sure it will kill but don't say I didn't warn you if the deer you shoot can't be recovered when you blister it with a .223. Live targets deserve your respect and bullets that can be expected to kill 100% of the time.As a 40 year deer hunter I wouldn't recommend anything less than 6mm or .243 for even the smallest whitetail. Use enough gun and save the .223 for varmints and such.
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where i live you cant use anything less than a .243 to hunt with
where i hunt you can use anything .22 centerfire or bigger
always a good idea to check your local
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Same answer here. Use .243 and up for deer. I knew one guy that took his .223 deer hunting 1 year and never used it again.
Since you said that shooting distances for deer in TN are usually more like "airgun distances", then you might consider a good 12ga shotgun with 3" "Magnum" type slugs (like hollow point). You can also scope the shotgun and zero it for 50yds. Just another option so you don't have to purchase a new rifle. Many here in Southern New York state hunt with shotguns because rifle hunting is not allowed in most places or within close proximity to NY city. In my county I have the choice of using both, or 1 or the other, depending which hunting grounds I go to.
I would also use a 30-30 if the distance is almost always under 100yds like you said. My Marlin 30-30 is scoped with a 3-9x32 and very accurate to 100yds. I was getting 3" groups at 100yds on open sights before I scoped it (from a good rest at the shooting range), but my eye sight was 10x better then.. Once I scoped it, it was always sub-1" groups with 150gr Remington Core-Lockt bullets @ 100yds. You can use a variety of bullets from 135 to 170gr in a 30-30. I like using 150 & 160gr for deer but use 170gr when I hunt in black bear territory. The 30-30 is a light gun/carbine to carry around the woods and easy to handle through thick brush. It can handle deer and bear no problem and it's a 30cal (or around 8mm) compared to a .22 caliber you are considering. It's no 30-06, but it packs a punch (about 25% less FPE than 30-06) without the noise and the recoil of a 30-06.
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I'm wanting the rifle for prairie dogs in Kansas and Coyotes locally. The deer thing is a bonus as I've actually never hunted them before. After looking at the cost of .243 ammo today, I'm pretty sure I'm going to go with the .223. It just seems wrong to waste a two dollar bullet on a rat! :)
Jim will let me use his 30-30 or my brother will let me use his if I really decide on deer hunting with a gun. First up though is the bow and I know it will kill one!
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Okay, I went to Walmart of all places out in the country The ones here in the city have NOTHING. They had a Savage .243 with the AccutTrigger and a scope for only $369. At a local gun store, they had a Rem 700 in .243 with a bipod, and a 16 or 20 x scope! They wanted the same for it but it was used. Maybe they give me some off for my 9mm pistol?
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Randy,
I hear ya about the ammo cost. That's one of the main reasons I went with a .223 for varmints.
When the local gun shop closed I found out I could order guns through our local Walmart. They keep a book under the gun counter with all the differant gun manufacturer's models that they can order right from the sporting goods department.
Since then I've ordered several guns and rifled shotgun barrels they don't keep on the rack. Prices were very good too.
Next time over that way, bring in model numbers your interested in and ask if they can do the same.
Paul
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I didn't know that about Walmart. I do know they are hit or miss when it comes to having guns. The ones in the county aren't too bad, but the ones in Knoxville you are lucky if they have pellets!
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I didn't know either, but lucky for me the day-time sporting goods counter guy is also a local hunter and the type who wants to help other hunters anyway he can. We've gotten to know each other by first name and had some nice talks about local hunting and raising kids, etc.
Anyother time I've done that, when someone other than Brian is at the counter, if whatever your looking for is not in plain sight the automatic answer is no, we don't carry that. Then I have to ask them to get the order book under the counter.
Paul.