GTA
PCP - HPA - C02 Gate => PCP DarkSiders Forum => : LAHossman March 21, 2010, 07:02:41 AM
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Please, pardon my ignorance in regards to this matter. But, I am in the process of buying a Marauder and trying to
decide what type of power plant to use. I have an old CO2 tank I used back in my paintball days. The cost to fill it
is relatively small. I have looked at the air compressors on PA, but really can't afford $2K (I am having enough trouble
convincing my wife I need another gun). I guess the long and the short of this question is, can you use any type of air
compressor to fill your PCP gun?
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John, you don't need a $2K compressor to fill your rifle. You need a SCUBA or SCBA tank and fill adaptors. If you go SCUBA route you can get the whole setup for as low as $200-$250 and you can fill your tank in SCUBA or paintball shops. To fill SCUBA tank costs $5-$8 and this will give you many fills to your rifle. There's a good write up in our library regarding your options: http://www.gatewaytoairguns.com/library/whatnow.htm
Good luck!
Chris
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That sounds good. Still, whats the difference between a regular air compressor and one for scuba?
Have you used CO2 with your Marauder? It looks like most of the people using this gun uses compressed
air.
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A regular air compressor produces app 100 - 200 PSI. Scuba compressors produce 3000 to 5000 PSI and they have filters to remove water and other possible contaminates. With my talon and a 88 CF tank I usually get 50 to 660 fills before the pressure drops to 2600- My low fill pressure.
Al
Al
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I've been looking/waiting for an affordable high pressure air compressor for a couple of years now. Crosman is supposedly working on/developinga consumer affordable HPA compressor...but no luck yet. Tom Gaylord, who writes the Pyramyd blog, said basically that the prototype compressor didn't make it to the SHOT Show this year...so we wait...until next year and see if they've got it together. Once there's an affordable compressor out there...the PCP air gun saleswill take a big leap. I believe that there's a lot of folks who dont want to mess with fill tanks or dont have access to a fill shop...dont want to use a handpump...and want their own HPA compressor. But the cost of a good compressor is prohibitive. Make a HPA compressor thats afforable, and the road is wide open.(http://../jscripts/tiny_mce/plugins/emotions/images/smiley-smile.gif)
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I agree with you 110% Dave. I would rather have a scuba tank than pump. If there were no scuba tanks and had to pump to shoot, I would not own any PCP's... But it would be even better if I had a compressor and fill station setup..:). Like you I have been waiting for an affordable compressor.
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Oh yeah a air compressor would be great if the price for one drop way down.
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What would you pay for one that is sized for PCP rifles? I think under $500 would be acceptable, 120v electric.
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Doug, the compressors we are talking about range from about $1800.00 on up over $4,000.00.. :)
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I'm aware of that. I'm asking how much would you PCP guys would pay for a small, PCP friendly compressor that would go to say 3600#.
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Ok, I understand now..:) The old saying goes like this..:) You get what you pay for..:) But what do you have in mind. Are you producing a economical air compressor for PCP with filters and and the good stuff?
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I've been thinking about it. Something 120v powered, portable, reliable, able to fill PB & PCP guns in a reasonable time. Last time I asked this question, all the nay-sayers complained it better be nearly free, that they loved being tied to a SCUBA shop..... I have a hard time believing guys that spend thousands of dollars on air rifles won't spring for a $500 pump.
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It would be great to find a good compressor that could fill a tank up to 4000 psi in less than 15 minutes for under $600.00 bills..:) I have given it allot of thought myself about purchasing one but the cost of the ones I have seen are way overboard in price.
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DougT, Why dont you build it, and they will come...(http://../jscripts/tiny_mce/plugins/emotions/images/smiley-smile.gif)
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were can ya get a 3000 psi pump for 500.00 ?
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I suspect there are a lot of "unseen" issues concerning the mass production of an affordable PCP compressor. Aside from the obvious problem of keeping cost down by finding dependable and efficient resources on the mechanical end, there is also the legal questions that probably come into play. Such as, what if some grossly amateur diver decides he's tired of taking his scuba tank to the dive shop and wants a do-it-yourself fill station at home? Perhaps his neighbor has a "PCP designated compressor" (supposing there is one already produced) and he gets permission to fill his tank. The PCP compressor doesn't have the expensive necessary filters (keeping cost down), only a moisture collector and a less expensive particle filter. The guy goes diving and gets some sort of viral lung infection from breathing contaminated air. He sues his neighbor and the company that produced the compressor. Before you dismiss such a law suit as ridiculous and unsubstantiated, think back to the Phillip Morris law suits some years back. I know Crosman has a legal source for all their new development pursuits. Could be the Crosman Compressor is presently a reality that is merely waiting for "legal clearance" to go into production.
Just a thought, Larry
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There is one being developed for paintball, that I have heard about. Don't know if it would be suitable for airguns.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ao7aZe4ZQzo
http://www.automags.org/forums/showthread.php?t=247451&page=1&pp=30
http://www.automags.org/forums/showthread.php?t=248525
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This sounds a bit better than the SCUBA air booster arrangements I've heard of,although it does have more moving parts hmmmmmm.
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I have seen this mini pump before. I do not think the guy every went any further with marketing it. Problem being is it takes so long to pump up a single tank.
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thats unfortunate that he didnt make it to marketing....I wouldnt care if it took 6-8 hrs to pump up a tank or even overnight for that matter. As long as I could run it in the garage without waking the nieghbors and it shuts off by itself.
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The youtube video was posted on 2/13/2010. Hopefully he is still working on it. My hat is off to anyone that is willing to take on this type of much needed project. I'm sure if anyone here would be willing to give it a try, it would be encouraged and appreciated by everyone.
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But did yer read...It takes 4 hours to fill a 68cubic INCH tank "700cc or so"
so yer looking at 2 hours to fill a gun or 1 hour for a top up...& a 80cubic foot
scuba tank ??? 24 hours ??? If heat dosn't get to it first..Uncooled..
But other than that is pretty good start...
Pete
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He gets away from the typical heat damage by having the motor run slowly. It runs at96rpm if I remember correctly. 24 hours is fine with me, as long as it shuts off by itself.
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Looks like he is still working on it. Here is the Facebook page.
http://www.facebook.com/pages/Miniature-Compressor-for-Paintball/216287806129
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Yes its going in production shortly. Looks good. Right price.
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I have an idea I don't know how to operationalize. Take a Hill pump and build a machine to pump it...where you convert circular energy into vertical strokes that actuate the Hill Pump. Hill's are great pumps with rebuild kits....the rest of the machine to operate it should be built in such a way as to minimize the stress on the Hill, but pump in such a manner as to fill up to 3000 or 4500 lbs quickly. I'm pretty sure it can be done cheaply, just beyond my knowledge how to convert circular energy of a motor or pulley to a 16 inch throw with sufficient force for the Hill pump.
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to much heat buildup i think. burn out quick.
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I have seen something like this, They put a large pulley-16" or so- Attach the hill pump handle to it and drive with a electric motor. The base of the hill pump must pivot. It looked like they were turning the pulley slowly like the speed you would hand pump. Looked like it definatly beats hand pumping -
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It said on face book that it would take 24 hrs to fill a scuba tank. I usually take mine to be refilled at App. 2400 -2600 psi. The top off may only be 8- 12 hrs?? For me the nearest dive shop is 30 minutes away and is open after 11 am till 6pm. This would pay for itself quickly if you factor in the cost of fuel, the hassle and time. Usually the dive shop owner is there and does my top off - fill. But sometimes it is a part timer and you have to tell them what it is for and sometimes they have to call the boss and confirm. ( the hassle)
Al
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I have an FX electric compressor that I purchased used about a year ago for $700 and it works great and sure beats pumping up the reservoir by hand.
The unit is water cooled, quiet and fills the airgun reservoirs relatively fast up to 3000PSI.
It is not designed for filling large tanks, weights 70 lbs and runs on 115 volts.
No longer in production.
http://i92.photobucket.com/albums/l32/togo4it/FXelectricpump.jpg
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Dang Jim, that was a tease...:) No longer in production.. The industry needs to make us pcp guys something similar. I am sure the demand is there now.
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Someone was making kits to pump the FX hand pumps with an electric motor. I believe this is a link to one of his ads. I bought a target he made, and it was very good quality.
http://www.network54.com/Forum/79574/message/1237239709/Custom+FX+Handpump+compressor
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Wow it does seem to work.
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If I remember correctly, Bob over at Steel Plinkers was working on that pump.. Great guy to do business with. Fantastic precision targets as well.
http://steelplinkers.com/ (http://steelplinkers.com/)
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Yes That's it!!! Very ingenious. Looks like wash machine pulleys and tensioners. I figured a 16" for the large pulley also, looks like it may be a little smaller with an extension.
Wow! This is really cool. Thanks!!! Might be a little out of my expertise (I don't have any welding tools), but I'd sure like to try to make one.
SF
Tom
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Go for it Tom, welding isnt that hard to do.
Ray
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Heres where the idea started...
FX made these for a while..
they were designed to fill a gun but
people used them to fill tanks so the wore out
very quickly ..so they were pulled from the market..
If yer look closely you will see they are water cooled..
Pete