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Target Shooting Discussion Forums General => Single Pump Air Rifles Target Gate => Topic started by: riflejunkie on January 26, 2009, 03:30:27 PM

Title: Daisy Avanti 853
Post by: riflejunkie on January 26, 2009, 03:30:27 PM
I  have one of these.  It is a weak shooter, but accurate.  For marksmanship training I think it is super.  Right now the rifle sells for $299 at Pyramid, BUT if you qualify you can get the rifle for $212 through the CMP.  
Single pump pneumatic = no recoil and no such thing as hold sensitivity issues.  
Aperture sights ------ for paper punching they are incredibly close to the accuracy of shooting with a scope but you don't have to worry about eye relief.
The trigger is awful but it gets better with use.  It is plastic just like the sights.  
The thing I like best about this gun is that it is sling friendly unlike a breakbarrel with that long slot in the stock.
The skill you develop with this rifle is transferable to your powderburners.  I know people who shoot high power and service rifle who practice with the 853.
Title: RE: Daisy Avanti 853
Post by: TCups on January 26, 2009, 04:09:07 PM
I have an 853 with apertures that has has a custom trigger job - very light, very crisp!  It shoots Vogel match pellets at a fairly steady 455 fps.  It is  one of my serious 10-Meter air rifles, along with the Walther LGR-U (another single pump) and the MM AR2078a (CO2) with the custom stock.  Mike tuned the AR2078 down for targets, shooting 7 gr RWS Hobby at about 630.  But the Walther is a 568 fps robot with never more than a couple of fps variation, whereas both the Daisy and the AR2078 will go up and down 10 fps, and the AR sometimes more when the temp changes or the CO2 runs low.

I think the accuracy of the 853, especially in my hands, is almost as good as the Walther.  But I must admit that I have come to prefer the size and weight of the Walther LGR-U as well as the LH adjustable walnut stock over the lighter air rifles when seriously shooting paper targets.  But then I am comparing the Daisy to an Olympic class single pumper at about three or four times the cost, used.

I have never put a sling on the Daisy 853 and know nothing about shooting with a sling.  I guess it is laziness on my part, but I only shoot 10-meter from a standing, off-hand position.  I suppose I could shoot from the kneeling or prone position, but the trouble is that my joints don't like it very well, especially when I try to get back up.  During the cold weather, I can easily shoot the Daisy or the Walther indoors at very short range (10-15 ft).  I don't readjust the target zero, but just shoot for consistency in groups.  It is great practice.
Title: RE: Daisy Avanti 853
Post by: riflejunkie on January 26, 2009, 04:20:31 PM
I love those pictures and your Walther is gorgeous.  You can't help yourself with the tinkering can you?  I like what you did to the 853.  Very nice on the buttplate.  I'm considering upgrading my 853 with the 753 sights.
Title: RE: Daisy Avanti 853
Post by: TCups on January 26, 2009, 04:30:01 PM
I am 6'4" and the little guns don't fit very well unless I "tinker".  Not so critical with the sporters, but when it comes to shooting at 10-meters, if everything doesn't fit when you shoulder the rifle, you probably are never going to improve.  I consider the relatively rare occasion of getting 10 out of 10 shots completely in the 30 mm bull at 10 meters a great success.  I also find that proper lighting of the target is essential for me (I have found almost every known excuse for suboptimal shooting performance, you see).  I haven't been shooting at 10 meters since the weather turned cold and the daylight hours short, so I am way out of practice.  When I first got the Walther, I would shoot a 60-round match every evening after work, but when you get home and it is already dark and cold, well, you get out of practice.  I don't have 10-meters indoors without shooting in the living room-dining room area where even the thought of a miss would put some of my very sensitive private parts at serious risk (and not from a wayward pellet).
Title: RE: Daisy Avanti 853
Post by: riflejunkie on January 26, 2009, 05:07:42 PM
Do you check your NPA when you shoot offhand? And how frequently?  How about a thread on shooting offhand?   Shooting is a check list endeavor.  
Title: RE: Daisy Avanti 853
Post by: nmmike on January 26, 2009, 05:07:46 PM
I have an 853 that I have installed a 753 rear diopter & the smaller 753 front barrel weight & globe with an annular insert. It is probably the most accurate rifle I have. I'm looking at a target that I shot semi-rested, it is 5 shots (@10meters) and it probably is no larger than .20 edge to edge, not CTC. This roughly shows what the rifle is capable of. A good shooter could probably go quite a bit smaller.

Mike
Title: RE: Daisy Avanti 853
Post by: TCups on January 26, 2009, 05:31:54 PM
Is NPA "natural point of aim"?  Yes.  I have read and need to re-read "The Ways of the Rifle"  and I do try to go through a checklist.  In that sense, it is much like golf, lining up with your feet first, making sure all the posture is right, relaxing all the muscle groups and trying to "melt down" just a bit, breathing doing my airrrrr gunzzzzzzz mantra, etc.  But this I know:  tall shooters are at a disadvantage compared to short shooters when it comes to standing, off-hand shooting.  And I am making myself learn to shoot lefty.  I am a natural right hander, but my left eye is dominant, and my visual acuity is much better on the left, so I can only shoot diopter sights lefty.  Matter of fact, the Walther LGR-U is the first LH rifle I have ever owned, and it took a bit of courage to actually invest in a quality LH target rifle.  All my air rifles are new since last April.  I am a relative air gun rookie, and I have been sticking to models with ambi or semi-ambi stocks for the most part.  I can shoot RH with a scope if I close my left eye, but I have pretty much committed myself to becoming a LH rifle shooter at this point.  Good exercise for the brain, I hear.
Title: Trigger fix
Post by: ac12basis on January 27, 2009, 07:13:17 AM
There are 3 things to fix on the x83 trigger1 - smoothen the trigger pull2 - lighten the trigger weight3 - shorten the trigger pullOf the 3, IMHO #1 will get you the biggest bang for the buck...and its fairly easy.  The "problem" is that the sear was simply stamped out of plate metal and never finished.  So you have a bunch of burrs on the sear, and these burrs hang up the sear as it is moving.  Your 2 options are #1 shoot it a LOT and wear the burrs down, or #2 remove the burrs.  Removing the burrs is simple, you just use #600 sand paper to CAREFULLY sand down the burrs.  Don't try to polish the sear surface, you could change the angle of the sear. Check out this fix on the Pilkingtons web site for #2 and 3.http://www.pilkguns.com/daisy853tm.shtmlYou can get the booklet on how to work on the x83 from the CMP.  I think it is only $1.50.
Title: RE: Daisy Avanti 853
Post by: ronbeaux on January 27, 2009, 12:38:42 PM
Your gonna hate to here this but women shooters have an advantage when it comes to off hand stand up shooting. Their center of gravity is lower. When you support the rifle you want to make sure your elbow is resting at or near your hip and the rifle is balanced so you really shouldn't even need your other hand except to reach up and pull the trigger. Lock your feet, relax, see where your pointing, shuffle your feet a little if it is off, look again, take a full breath and let half out, then either pull the trigger or start over if it goes more than 6 seconds before you can get a zero. Do it the exact same way everytime.

Man I like this section of the forum.
Title: RE: Daisy Avanti 853
Post by: TCups on January 27, 2009, 01:04:23 PM
Yes, all of that, and also, subtle changes in how far back the rear foot is positioned to bring the natural point of aim up or down a bit as needed instead of using the arm muscles to raise the rifle.  Losing all the muscle tension and letting the bones support the rifle.  But there is still something "intangible" there that I can never quite master -- some sort of rhythm I occasionally fall into where the shots start coming naturally almost effortlessly on target, and I can put 4 or maybe even 5 shots in a single hole.  But the instant I am conscious of that and allow myself to "Ah ha! I've finally got it" or "this is going to be a great group!" then, here comes the flyer.  It is a mental thing, very hard to do consistently, and the more you struggle thinking about it, the more it slips away.  I guess you almost have to be brain dead to shoot 10-meter competitively -- or chug a few beers  to calm the nerves, huh?
Title: RE: Daisy Avanti 853
Post by: daveshoot on January 29, 2009, 01:35:23 AM


I just snagged the Avanti that was on Gunbroker. Sounds like the trigger is not a DIY job? Any tips or contacts for this?



(Is that the x83 trigger referenced?)

Title: RE: Daisy Avanti 853
Post by: riflejunkie on January 29, 2009, 10:42:22 AM
Go to pilkington air guns for a tutorial on how to do it.
Title: RE: Daisy Avanti 853
Post by: daveshoot on January 29, 2009, 11:00:15 AM
Thanks, also to ac12basis. Upon a closer (awake) reading he had already answered me. I am kind've excited about this one, but I guess it will be a week or so to delivery.
Title: RE: Daisy Avanti 853
Post by: Gene_SC on January 29, 2009, 01:14:52 PM
Tommy, is that 853 for sale...:)
Title: RE: Daisy Avanti 853
Post by: TCups on January 29, 2009, 01:30:37 PM
No, but when next I see you, I would be happy to drop her off for a long visit with you.  By the way, her twin sister belongs to J 3n003 (who by the way did the re-finishing of the wood on this one).  When last I spoke with J, he was looking to sell some of his collection.  You might see if he would sell you his.
Title: RE: Daisy Avanti 853
Post by: riflejunkie on January 30, 2009, 11:00:31 PM
The 853 is a dryfire rifle as well.  Just open and close the bolt without pumping and you are ready to safely dryfire.  This is not a light trigger and it functions like a 2 stage so take up that slack BEFORE you are ready for the shot to break.  If you wait for when you are ready to shoot to start your trigger pull it will ruin your shot.
Title: RE: Daisy Avanti 853
Post by: birdmove on February 15, 2009, 03:19:55 PM
I have a question. I have been considering getting a Daisy 953. I've heard good things about the 10m accuracy with those guns. I know the velocity is pretty slow. What happens if you move the target to 25 yards? Does the accuracy go down the drain, or is it still good for paper punching?

  Thanks, Jon
Title: Re: Daisy Avanti 853
Post by: ac12basis on February 17, 2009, 02:50:38 PM
Dave
x53 refers to the family; 953, 853, 753
there is also the 88x family; 888, 887  (same trigger, but co2 power plant vs SSP in the x53)
Title: 953 beyond 10 meters
Post by: ac12basis on February 17, 2009, 02:57:46 PM
Should be fine.

In general, when you go much beyond 10 meters, you should switch to a round nose pellet to maintain accuracy.  Its about aerodynamics.  At close range it doesn't matter, but it does at longer ranges.  And a wadcutter is NOT aerodynamic.
After that it becomes your skill in reading the wind.

And be aware that the trajectory may start to look like a motar.
Title: RE: Daisy Avanti 853
Post by: riflejunkie on February 18, 2009, 12:49:23 AM
Jon, I've also been thinking about getting the 953.  I think the stock is better shaped than the 853 and other than the sights the rifles appear the same.  The 853 has a Lothar Walther barrel, and I don't know anything about the barrel on the 953 but for the price of $72 from Pyramid it won't break the bank for a training rifle.  The 753 and 853 sight systems will fit on the rifle.  
The problem I've had with my 853 is that the sights run out of adjustment around 20 yds or a little less.  As bad as the trigger was, it is not bad now.  I did a little careful sanding on the sear and trigger contact area and I have been satisfied with the result.
Title: RE: Daisy Avanti 853 w/ sling
Post by: TCups on February 18, 2009, 12:55:59 AM
OK, Charlotte, the sling has been ordered and I may try to play with the 853 in prone position this weekend.  Are you going to post a match for 10-meter prone this weekend?
Title: RE: Daisy Avanti 853 w/ sling
Post by: riflejunkie on February 18, 2009, 01:03:20 AM
Actually I was thinking about doing a post on the position first and give folks a chance to work out the kinks with sling issues first.  What's your feeling about the target?
Title: RE: Daisy Avanti 853
Post by: Gene_SC on February 18, 2009, 01:53:45 AM
Was over at J's yesterday and looked at his enormouse collection but he did not mention the Avanti or Avanti's were for sale. I may have taken one home with me..:) So I am looking to by a Model 753 Elite. I think that one has the good diapler on it.
Title: RE: Daisy Avanti 853
Post by: Gene_SC on February 18, 2009, 01:54:33 AM
Charlotte, who is CMP and how do you qualify?
Title: RE: Daisy Avanti 853 w/ sling
Post by: TCups on February 18, 2009, 02:59:46 AM
Charlotte:

If you stick to 10-meters, I can lay on the carpet, indoors and don't have to worry about the weather.  Any further and it becomes an outdoor event.  Less times when I can shoot.  Possibility of rain or bad weather.  Dirt and grass . . .
Title: RE: Daisy Avanti 853
Post by: TCups on February 18, 2009, 03:18:05 AM
Gene:

Civilian Marksmanship Program.  See:  http://www.odcmp.com/
Title: RE: Daisy Avanti 853
Post by: riflejunkie on February 18, 2009, 05:48:14 AM
That's right Doc.  I like the 10 meter distance.  Luckily I have a big store that I can shoot 25 yds indoors,LOL.  I'd love it if someone besides me tried the 10 meter and the 50 ft. smallbore target at 10 meters and gave me some feedback on how you feel about the targets.  
Mick, could you give us a tutorial on scoring the 10 meter target?
Title: HEY, RJ, check this out!
Post by: daved on February 18, 2009, 01:31:14 PM
Hey, Charlotte, don't the 753 and 953 share the same stock design, with the 953 being synthetic to the 753's wood?  If it's shape you're after, how about a new 753 stock for $37 plus shipping?

I posted on the Yellow looking for a 753 stock, what I got was a couple of links to possible sources.  Gun Parts Corp. has the 753 stock for $37.25 plus shipping, here's the link: http://www.gunpartscorp.com/  This would let you keep the well broken in action you have, with the better stock, and it's cheaper than the 953.  Best of all worlds :-).  I think there's going to be one on the way for my 853 soon.  Later.

Dave
Title: RE: HEY, RJ, check this out!
Post by: riflejunkie on February 18, 2009, 02:01:38 PM
I can't find it
Title: Re: Daisy Avanti 853
Post by: ac12basis on February 18, 2009, 02:26:07 PM
RJ
here it is
http://www.e-gunparts.com/DisplayAd.asp?chrProductSKU=529790&chrSuperSKU=&MC=
The 753 stock is the top one.  But the pix on that page is an 853 stock.
Title: RE: Daisy Avanti 853
Post by: Fatman on August 07, 2009, 10:36:03 PM
Hi TCups:

Love both guns in the picture.  Can't afford a Walther or any of its cousins but might be able to spring for an adjustable butt plate for my 953.

Is that a Morgan on your 853? Looks like the one on yours solves two problems, LOP and raised cheek weld to keep your head more upright.  Does the adjustable butt plate make the gun illegal for 3 position as it exceeds the original stock dimensions?  Might do it anyway as I don't currently shoot competitively anymore.

I have the 853 rear sight on my 953 and it seems fine.  An early version of the sight had a plastic base but the later one is metal.  Looked at one of the Avanti 753 diopters (Chinese version) and it had noticable play in it so I stuck with the 853's. The 753 Avanti rear would have cost darned near as much as the original gun anyway.  

The 853 front sight I have is a realy cheap stamped out metal piece that is functional but very crude.  I sprang for the 753 version.  It has a smaller diameter barrel weight which looks better, is lighter, and the sight is much better made.  The lighter weight seems to suite the gun better.  The 753 front will raise the sight line a fair amount.  On the plus side it helps with the cheek weld, on the minus side it raises the 853 rear sight enough to make it more succeptable to flex and possible damage.  

Thinking of putting the 753 front on my old Crosman 1760 if it will fit.  Havn't tried it yet but do have a steel breach with an 853 rear.  Good shooter but the stock isn't very target friendly.

Cheers,
Fatman
Title: RE: Daisy Avanti 853
Post by: TCups on August 07, 2009, 11:25:03 PM
Reviving an old post, eh?

J 3n00n both acquired the air rifle used and did the work on the Avanti for me.  Don't know what brand he used for the butt plate.  I believe that the spacers came with the rifle, though.

Can't say if the adjustable butt plate violates any competition rules -- I don't shoot in any formal competitions.  But for me, it feels right.  At present, my Avanti is spending some quality time on an extended visit with Gene Curtis.

Hey Gene!  Are you shooting the Daisy any these days?
Title: RE: HEY, RJ, check this out!
Post by: Fatman on August 12, 2009, 06:12:46 AM
Hi:

Feeling bummed.

Got a buddy to order that 753 stock from Numrich for his 853.  He loves the feel of the stock on my 953, but hates "plastic".

Just got a call.  It arrived today, but its the same as the stock on his 853!  It's the one in the Numrich picture.  He said he oredered the correct number, got charged the right price and the label on it is correct, but it aint no 753.  Looks like it's going back.  Daisy seems reasonable on pricing, maybe it would be as cheap or cheaper to get the 753 stock from directly them.

I hate it when I recommend something and it turns out to be a bum deal.

He also said that the wood is soft, light as a feather and looks more like stained pine than any hardwood he's ever seen. I always thought the wood and finish on his 853 looked a bit like that.  If that's the case with all of the 753 and 853 stocks, a better bet might be a 953 composite stock.  It looks like it has an identical profile to the 753, it's very rigid and is surpisingly heavy.  The composite will also be more stable and remain unaffected by humidity and moisture. The butt plate is removable so you could easily add weight to the the rear.  It's almost certainly the same stock as on the 853c.  I suspect the composite stock is also cheaper.  You would have to call Daisy customer service or emial them for a schematic (for the part #) and price as the information doesn't seem to be available on line..

Has anyone else ordered one from Numrich and got the right thing?  Is the wood from Daisy on all 753 and 853 stocks like that?

Would be interested on your comments.

Cheers,
Fatman