GTA
General Discussion To Gateway To Airguns => Back Room => : imadogman March 19, 2009, 12:02:53 PM
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Why I Carry a Gun.
My old grandpa once said to me, "Son, there comes a time in every
man's life when he stops bustin' knuckles and starts bustin' caps and
usually it's when he becomes too old to take an ass whoopin'. I don't carry
a gun to kill people. I carry a gun to keep from being killed. I don't carry
a gun to scare people. I carry a gun because sometimes this world can be a
scary place. I don't carry a gun because I'm paranoid. I carry a gun because
there are real threats in the world. I don't carry a gun because I'm evil. I
carry a gun because I have lived long enough to see the evil in the world. I
don't carry a gun because I hate the government. I carry a gun because I
understand the limitations of government. I don't carry a gun because I'm
angry. I carry a gun so that I don't have to spend the rest of my life
hating myself for failing to be prepared. I don't carry a gun because I want
to shoot someone. I carry a gun because I want to die at a ripe old age in
my bed, and not on a sidewalk somewhere tomorrow afternoon. I don't carry a
gun because I'm a cowboy. I carry a gun because, when I die and go to
Heaven, I want to be a cowboy. I don't carry a gun to make me feel like a
man. I carry a gun because men know how to take care of themselves and the
ones they love. I don't carry a gun because I feel inadequate. I carry a gun
because, unarmed and facing three armed thugs, I am inadequate. I don't
carry a gun because I love it. I carry a gun because I love life and the
people who make it meaningful to me. "Police Protection" is an oxymoron.
Free citizens must protect themselves. Police do not protect you from crime;
they usually just investigate the crime after it happens and then call
someone in to clean up the mess. Personally, I carry a gun because I'm too
young to die and too old to take an ass whoopin'." .....author unknown (but
obviously brilliant)
Remember the average response time to a 911 call is over 4 minutes.
The average response time of a 357 magnum is 1400 FPS.
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Dave that was deep!!!!! How true about police protection,they arrive after the fact!!!!!
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Very well said Dave.
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I second that amen. I feel it should be a law that all law abiding citzens own a gun of some kind. Why not there are laws telling me what I can and can't do. I bet the crime rate would drop if people would exercise their 2nd ammendment rights
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Very,,, Very Well said Dave!! Thats why I "Carry" 8) (Im too old to fight) :0 Tim.
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Oh so true Dave !
I have tried to tell people all my life, that the Police only deal with crime, not protect people from crime ! The Life you save, May be you own !
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thats our concept for the rest of our lives....
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I like the quote from Al Capone too "You can get more with a kind word and a gun, than with a kind word alone" Al Capone
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Damn right doggy, thats good stuff there !!
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Good Read.....I carry a gun because my knees are to bad to run!!!!!!!!
Shelby
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Perhaps I should simply read this post and the subsequent replies and keep my opinions to myself; however, I think I'm going to chime in on this. You are, after all, sort of my "adopted family."
Many people find fault with the police based upon personal interaction (which may or may not be welcomed,) tales retold by family members or friends, television, news print, etc.
It's true, as one of the posts state, police officers are reactive in the fight against crime. Not a one of us, no matter how hard we try, is prescient...no matter how much we wish we could be. The statement about response time (4 minutes) is probably fairly representative of fact, which is one reason why CPR fails so miserably when we get a "request for ambulance" run. We simply can't be there in time. In my own case, in the 21 years I've been a police officer, I've "lost" over 200 people. Not because I didn't give it my best, but once you're outside the 4-minute window, you're really just doing CPR for "show."
Before I get off-track, I realize the true nature of the post is "Why I carry a gun." One person posted a statement that stated he felt every law abiding citizen should be required to own a firearm. Well, going back to my own experiences, I've found that many of these same, law-abiding citizens, once pushed to the limit either by drugs, alcohol, anger or a mix of the first three, resort to the firearms they legally own to end the life of a family member or friend, most often during the holiday seasons. Do I wish to abolish our 2nd ammendment rights, absolutely not, I'm all for owning a firearm. We just have to remember, we have to take the good (owning a firearm) with the bad.
I'm not going to go into detail about my next point except to say when the decision to pull the trigger is made, you can't bring it back. You live with that decision every day of your life for the remainder of your days. While you may, and the department may, and the prosecutor's office may feel you made the correct decision to end someone's life...the family members have years to hire the best attorneys, depose you for months on end in preparation for a federal civil rigths violation lawsuit, attempt to make you look as if an attempt on your life was your own fault, etc. To sit through civil litigation for over a year while attorneys nit-pick your judgement and actions adds an almost unbelievable amount of stress on your daily life. Suffice to say, you have the right to bear arms, you have the right to use a firearm in your defense, but in today's society, even though you may be perfectly right, you WILL be sued and it is NOT fun.
As a police officer who performs several functions for my department...firstly as a patrolman, range officer, SRT (Special Response Team) Initial Entry Officer, Field Training Officer (FTO) etc., I tell all who listen the greatest weapon we have in our arsenal is our mind...not the gun.
Do we as police officers sometimes come up lacking? Sure we do..we're human, we make mistakes just like anyone else. But, in our defense, we do the very best we can. I know my department does, the guys and women who work with me do and short of devine intervention, that's about all anyone can ask.
Just my .2 cents.
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Well, I don't carry a gun on my person, and I am to old to fight back any longer. So I guess if I ever get in the right place at the wrong time I will just have to suffer the consequences. But when I am in my home I do have weapons in order to protect myself and property and I would not hesitate to use them in that case.
BUT there is one thing to consider. If you do fatally injure someone it will stay with you for the rest of your life. Maybe not tomorrow but it will eventually catch up to you. So you have to be mentally prepared to pull the trigger and understand the real consequences of your actions.
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Nice sentiment, however, the decision not to pull the trigger carries the same weight. I have the right to carry. If a situation arises where I need to decide to shoot, better the lawyer than the cemetary. And yes, I have had personal experience with policemen, my uncle was a state trooper, nice guy. Statistics aside, giving up my guns so that some "upset" person does not hace access to a gun is a useless argument. If you are willing to be robbed, have your home invaded and accept the police will do their best, great. Not me. Get over the fence, get past the dogs, meet mr personal protection. I am not out looking for a fight. I keep my doors locked when driving so that you can't just pull it open, etc. As the old saying goes, better him than me. John
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dnttech - 3/19/2009 7:07 PM Perhaps I should simply read this post and the subsequent replies and keep my opinions to myself; however, I think I'm going to chime in on this. You are, after all, sort of my "adopted family." Many people find fault with the police based upon personal interaction (which may or may not be welcomed,) tales retold by family members or friends, television, news print, etc. It's true, as one of the posts state, police officers are reactive in the fight against crime. Not a one of us, no matter how hard we try, is prescient...no matter how much we wish we could be. The statement about response time (4 minutes) is probably fairly representative of fact, which is one reason why CPR fails so miserably when we get a "request for ambulance" run. We simply can't be there in time. In my own case, in the 21 years I've been a police officer, I've "lost" over 200 people. Not because I didn't give it my best, but once you're outside the 4-minute window, you're really just doing CPR for "show." Before I get off-track, I realize the true nature of the post is "Why I carry a gun." One person posted a statement that stated he felt every law abiding citizen should be required to own a firearm. Well, going back to my own experiences, I've found that many of these same, law-abiding citizens, once pushed to the limit either by drugs, alcohol, anger or a mix of the first three, resort to the firearms they legally own to end the life of a family member or friend, most often during the holiday seasons. Do I wish to abolish our 2nd ammendment rights, absolutely not, I'm all for owning a firearm. We just have to remember, we have to take the good (owning a firearm) with the bad. I'm not going to go into detail about my next point except to say when the decision to pull the trigger is made, you can't bring it back. You live with that decision every day of your life for the remainder of your days. While you may, and the department may, and the prosecutor's office may feel you made the correct decision to end someone's life...the family members have years to hire the best attorneys, depose you for months on end in preparation for a federal civil rigths violation lawsuit, attempt to make you look as if an attempt on your life was your own fault, etc. To sit through civil litigation for over a year while attorneys nit-pick your judgement and actions adds an almost unbelievable amount of stress on your daily life. Suffice to say, you have the right to bear arms, you have the right to use a firearm in your defense, but in today's society, even though you may be perfectly right, you WILL be sued and it is NOT fun. As a police officer who performs several functions for my department...firstly as a patrolman, range officer, SRT (Special Response Team) Initial Entry Officer, Field Training Officer (FTO) etc., I tell all who listen the greatest weapon we have in our arsenal is our mind...not the gun. Do we as police officers sometimes come up lacking? Sure we do..we're human, we make mistakes just like anyone else. But, in our defense, we do the very best we can. I know my department does, the guys and women who work with me do and short of devine intervention, that's about all anyone can ask. Just my .2 cents.
For your 21 years of service Sir. I only carried a "Badge & Gun" for 2 years,,,,I still 10 years later "Help Out" ocasionally. The "Thin Blue Line" never leaves you in ANY way. Responce time???? That is just logistics Folks,,,, NOT the Police/Deputys on the jobs fault. I get VERY upset when Folks "Bad Mouth" the average "Cop" on the job. Many also "Bad Mouth" Lawyers,,,, that is untill Ya need one??????? I will say,,, I think CWP (Concealed Weapon Permits) are basicly a good thing & a deterant to crime. I will however add: Most states IMO leave ALOT to be desired pertaining to basic training to obtain a CWP. Hitting "K-5" @ 10 yrds just aint enough IMO??:o Also Robert,,, as you said about deciding to use deadly force & not being able to change that desision,,,, the "Matters" that will certainly follow the decision you made,,,, VERY true.:0 Stay safe Robert,,, may God Bless You on your shifts,,,,,, Tim.
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I have a great respect for police officers. I have also met a few that I would swear became one because they got picked on in school a lot, and now they have the power.I think everyone should carry, if they are trained well. I dont on a daily basis, but while on vacation or car traveling, you bet.If you come into my house at 3am, chances are you will be shot. Once you enter MY house, [ uninvited ], you belong to me. I WILL protect my family and myself any way I can. I accept the consequences for keeping my wife safe.
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I don't want anyone to think that I am putting down the local Police !
If not for them, every street in every city and townwould be chaos, everyone would need to defend themselves, and lifeaswe know it could not exist.
But having been in Law Enforcement myself, the only time that the police prevent crime, is when one is stopped at a traffic light, where a criminal is stalking a victim, and is scared off by the policepresence. And the officer or officers never know how much crime that they prevented !
But most often, the police have no idea that a crime is committed until they are called, and then they do everything within their power to apprehend the criminal that committed the crime. So, if you depend on the police to protect you 24/7/365, it can't happen ! And if you remember the case where two elderly women were beaten and raped for several hours, and the one sister called the police several times, and the responding officers drove by, a few times, and saw nothing suspicious, so nothing was done to help these women. Well they survived this heinous crime, and sued the city and police department, and the court ruled that the police have no responsibility to the individual citizen ! The moral of the story is, you better be prepared to defend yourself, until the police arrive.
Now the mere announcement of you being armed, will scare off many criminals, as they don't carry very good health care, and hate to be shot ! I know,I deterred a few individuals by just opening my jacket as they approached, others need to see that you are armed before leaving, but I never needed to draw my weapon to deter their actions.
The Police perform a much required service in a society that wishes to be "civilized". Without them armed gangs would roam the streets doing whatever they desire, without much fear of being stopped. Kind of sounds like California ? But without them, it would be much, muchworse !
And while Robertand Gene arecorrect, the ramifications of shooting someone is very serious, both mentally and financially, You must decide if You would rather be Carried by 6, or judged by 12 ! It is a very difficult decision that should be veryseriouslymade !
Bill
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Vinny, the first sentence of your post reflects on several members of my own department. I swear to God some of those guys...and one womam must have been the target of bullies when they were in school. As a field training officer of a 140 person department I get to help weed out this type of personality during the training process; however, every so often one will slip by. Trust me, though...we do your very best to get rid of them during their first year.
Bob
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When criminals learn that average people like us carry guns, that in itself will deter criminal activity just like our police officers. In Arizona the carry permits have tripled over the last year or so. Bad guys take note of this. Just the other day their was a home invasion and the owner shot and killed two of them. My wife and I carry and we will defend ourselves. If they break into our home bad things will happen to them. My wife won't shoot a pellet gun because she prefers a .44 magnum. Paul
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I vote to put that in the library!
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robert i live in nyc and the police r crazy out here i say about 70 % and im in the middle.i treat them with respect cause u never know when u r gonna need there help, but enough is enough this city is killing each other on a regular basis and i worry about my children cause they r great kids they go to school ,work, gym or just stay home playing games and there friends i select i really do cause i dont want to ever know my sons r involved with gangs and so far so good they have never had problems with police .no my point is i live in a high crimed area which targets everyone from what i have seen. isnt there some type of training police get when needing to tell the difference .when people r apprehanded by cops they get scared cause cops open fire on people like if there target practicing there is alot of that going on in nyc or is it everywhere the same cause i need to move out of nyc and live in maine hopefully the police and the people get along .im 42 and in nyc cops where your friends and they play with us even knew our names and out of nowhere cops and people started shootin at each other when in reality we need each other u guys go home to a family and to a normal life y so much drama now man i wish things could change cause we r killing each other and its sad when u got to carry a gun to hurt or kill any of GODS CHILDREN I DONT HAVE GUNS BUT I HAVE AIRGUNS AND I SHOOT SAFELY UPSTATE OR MY TARGET IN MY APARTMENT 15YDS I DONT EVEN HUNT BUT WANT TO LEARN....WHAT CAN I DO ABOUT THE ABOVE SITUATION WAIT FOR ONE OF MY KIDS OR MY WIFE GET SHOOT I EVEN HAVE 4 PIT BULLS PROTECTING MY HOME ...GOD BLESS US ALL I LOVE EACH AND EVERYONE HERE WE R FAMILY .....JORGE LOPEZ ....ROBERT PRAY CAUSE ILL PRAY FOR U AND YOUR TOURS......
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We had a permit holder here in Jaxcarjacked bout two weeks ago in a crowded flea market parking lot...The guy(permit holder)opened fire as the jacker fledhitting his car and several other vehicles...Almost hit a few innocents...People like him give CWP owners a bad name..I'm a firm believer that any permit holder should haveto undergotraining (not just a day at the range) with the exception of former Military/LEO..
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Well, that post stirred things up. I agree with much of what everyone has said about being trained properly, and that means more than just being able to hit what you are aiming at. I wondered what kind of responses I would read, and I am not surprised by any of them.
That being said, a friend of mine once said. "If you are going to bring a weapon into the situation, be prepared to use it, otherwise you might want it to be made out of chocolate, just in case you get it fed to you."
I know that a weapon is a great equalizer, but not so much so if you and the bad guy each have one. Also, you may want to consider that the bad guy probably has more experience than you do.
If you think about it, a Smith and Wesson Model 29 in 44 Mag is a lot of chocolate to eat all at once. You might choke to death if you eat it too fast, so be careful, and try to make the right decision at the right time, and sometimes running might be the best option. (unless you really like chocolate).
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moved to bottom of thread
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Why would the bad guy have more experience than me? I practice all the time. My buddy has a shooting range set up in his back yard. The police have visited and we were told how to improve the back stop. I am not advocating the indescriminate use of firearms, but the IDPA, NRA and several other organizations are available for training. Shooting at a fleeing criminal is not OK, shooting at a threatening criminal who is not responding to the situation appropriately, ie not running away when a gun is pointed at him or her, or putting up their hands etc. I am for me being able to protect me and mine. Not sure about military experience being that great for this type of carry, I spent 10 years in the Navy and have learned more about the use of deadly force in the last 2 years than when I was in and authorized to use deadly force if neccasary. I also ussually just carry pepper spray. I don't want to kill someone over a couple of dollars, but I am not sure that everyone is willing to just take my wallet and run. At home, different story. If they are willing to come in my house, castle doctrine. John
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John,
All the training on the range can not prepare you for the taking of the life. Under extreme conditions, with a criminal coming at you, some will shoot the criminal, others will not be able to. The only way to find out which you are, is to be in that situation.
We are thought from our youth, thou shall not to kill ! And after you have killed someone, for any reason, you will live with a sour ball in the pit of your stomach, and the memory of that criminals face, perhaps forever. Yes you will have the memory of how justified you were, and the knowledge that you saved the life of yourself and your family, and that you did the right thing, but you will have that sour ball and memories !
So if there is any other alternative ?
Bill
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Bill, we may have different views on this. If getting rid of guns was a useful solution I would be all for i. But that is not the solution or even a good idea. Hitler would be the poster child for why gun control is a bad idea. Some times hard decisions have to be made. I believe it is best to practice and be prepared. I am sure the taking of a human life is not the same as deciding what is for dinner. However, being willing to allow criminals the ability to act with impunity is also not Ok with me. The debate here is not how I would feel but about training, preparation and proper tools for the job. If I am ever in a position to need to decide, better I have practiced, thought about, and made the decision based on my and my family's need for safety rather than overreacting out of fear and not understanding my options fully. I was not taght thou shall not kill. So, we will have to disagree on that. Hopefully I will never need to find out. But if it becomes necassary, chance favors the well prepared. John
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Big_Bill - 3/20/2009 7:13 PM
John,
All the training on the range can not prepare you for the taking of the life. Under extreme conditions, with a criminal coming at you, some will shoot the criminal, others will not be able to. The only way to find out which you are, is to be in that situation.
We are thought from our youth, thou shall not to kill ! And after you have killed someone, for any reason, you will live with a sour ball in the pit of your stomach, and the memory of that criminals face, perhaps forever. Yes you will have the memory of how justified you were, and the knowledge that you saved the life of yourself and your family, and that you did the right thing, but you will have that sour ball and memories !
So if there is any other alternative ?
Bill
Very WELL said Uncle Bill. JUSTIFIED or not,,,,,,, you WILL live with it the rest of your life. You WILL find yourself asking yourself,,, "what if" MANY thousands of times for the rest of your life. WORD. Even if it is justified,,,,,you will think about it EVERY DAY for the rest of your life,,,, it NEVER goes away. years later,,, it will still seem like just yesterday it happened. You can never fully recover. You just learn to live with it. Tim. There are alternatives,,, unless you are facing a gun??
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Great discussion. I'm not in law enforcement, however, I've ridden along with my son-in-law when he was an officer. It's a scary place out there at 2am in almost every city or town regardless of size. I have the utmost respect for all law enforcement - especially patrol officers. I have also worked with local government and police in Emergency Management. I've even been in JAIL - as a VISITOR, of course, on a tour with our Chief of Police.
Here's my take on the entire situation. Everyone should join their local Police Support Citizen's Groups. Some towns even have a Citizens Police Academy. If possible, arrange a ride-along with a patrol officer one night. You'll be surprised what you see in your "safe" little town at 2am in the morning on the weekend. Then arrange to actually visit your local city or county jail. You'll find plenty of "interesting" people there. Then you can decide the best way to protect yourself and family.
I don't want to start any religious or moral arguments. However, the original Hebrew text reads: Thy shall not MURDER. Murder is a lot different than KILL.
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Hello John,
I do not remember saying to hand in your guns ! ButI will say, if put to the task, you may not be able to do it ! If you announce to the criminal that you have called the police, and are armed, 90% of criminals will leave quickly. They never want to break into a residence that has an armed homeowner, they want an easy safe job. If your faced with one of the remaining 10%, you may find out if you can take a life.
All that I am saying is to be prepared for the worse, but do what you feel is possible to deter the situation from ending poorly.
Get the drop on the perp as he comes up the stairs, or enters the room, scream (with a commanding voice)for him to hit the floor ! Put your hands behind you head ! Be prepared tofire if your commands are not responded to. But if responded to, keep away from the perp, and keep you gun on him while your wife calls the police, if she hasn't already. And Watch the Perp carefully, as he may be armed...but always be prepared !!!!! and Careful !
I guard my family and home, I have guns, and I have no doubt of what I will be able to do, if the situation demands it. But I will do it as a last resort ! I do have that sour ball in the pit of my stomach. And I know it only gets bigger !
Bill
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John, I think that you missed my point about experience. You stated "Why would the bad guy have more experience than me? I practice all the time."
When I stated that the criminal might have more experience than you do, I meant that he probably had more experience at being an unethical, immoral, thoughtless and uncaring %$#*&. He might also have more experience shooting at human beings, and he may never shoot at paper targets because they don't bleed, and he can't get another teardrop tatoo if he shoots one.
Will he or shehave more experience at being a ruthless killer? I would think that might be a possibility too, since most people have never killed anyone.
I applaud you for training and practicing, but how will you react in a bad situation??? I don't know what I would do, although I have played it out in my mind a few times. (Usually right after some nutcase shoots up a place full of innocent and unarmed people.) I think that I know what I would do, but until it happens (God forbid), I won't really know. I think that my lifestyle keeps me out of places where many of these kinds of things happen, but who knows if or when someone might just want to enter my home and take something, or cause me harm. I am prepared for that...at least as prepared as I can be. Not sure how things might turn out if I am awakened from a deep sleep with little or no time to react.
There are other things that we can do at home to protect ourselves. Thieves don't like lights or alarms, and a big dog that barks loudly at intruders is a wonderful thing. A little forethought might prevent an altercation.
Good luck!
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A lot of very good comments and points brought up here. I too dont know how I would react.I wouldnt consiously plan on shooting at a guy running that threatened my wife or me, bit in all the excitement, if I did and I hit him, well, HE shouldnt have put us in that situation. Heck, I may take off running like a little girl, I dont know, But the person that causes a situation like that deserves what he gets. I personally dont mind hearing on the news about "this gang member shot that gang member last night...". One less a. h. to hurt someone that matters. File it under DSAF. [ did society a favor ]. I dont mean to offend anybody, thats just how I feel. They should bring back Wanted -dead or alive posters and hang em up all over.
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If you follow the post you will see I have several dogs, a fence, I am often on call and have to wake up and go to work for emergencies. I don't want you to think badly of me, but shooting someone who has entered my house after facing the fence, the dogs, etc will not be, for me, a hard decision. They may die, after all getting shot is dangerous, they may not. They will not harm me or my wife and to get past the german shepherd they will have to have all ready done damage to a valued member of my household, maybe two as one of my labs is not to friendly to males other than me. I am sure many people are ambivalent about whether to shoot, I am not. come into my house uninvited and the results will be predictable. One of us is going to get shot. John
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Think yall should try a IDPA match and see. John
http://www.idpaforum.yuku.com/forums/5/t/LOCAL-IDPA-Match-Announcements-and-Results.html
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Up here in Canada where I'm at....a call to 911 will take a minimum of 20 minutes and MORE LIKE 40 minutes untill they get to my farm...
Hmmmm....better not shoot yourself in the foot....could be fatal.
whipperwilly,
Alberta, Canada
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Yea I think that is very truthfull! Another reason to Carry a Gun is Wild Animals, Like Bears, Cougars, etc in some areas of the Country!!!
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In the most general sense, "why I carry a gun" is a philosophical statement. We, as a civil society, have come the point where we expect a lot of things to be provided to us by our government: security and personal protection, medical care, retirement benefits, etc. As our society becomes demonstrably less "civil", less moral, infiltrated by illegal immigrants who are "outside" of any American law, especially in the southwest and larger cities, and the whole mix is stirred by financial stress from an economy that is tanking, the likelihood of an encounter with a violent or potentially violent criminal escalates.
The sad truth is that even though we may have some of the most dedicated, honest, brave and committed law enforcement civil servants, the task at hand is daunting and crime is on the rise. Our courts, prison systems and law enforcement agencies are being overwhelmed. To reasonably expect nearly instant response from law enforcement, or absolutely safety in all public situations is as naive as the notion that your medical care and retirement needs will be provided by the state. The mechanisms and institutions are in place, yes, in theory, but they can never entirely cope with the task at hand.
A lawless society is a frightening thought. But to the extent the American citizen has become entirely content to rely on someone else, some state institution, to always protect them, as a substitute for upholding a personal code of ethical and moral behavior and self-reliance as our first line of defense against a lawless society, to that extent we place ourselves at risk.
Teach your children well. Understand that the Constitutional right to bear arms is meant to facilitate self-reliance in protecting yourself, your family, your property, and your country, if needed. But it comes with the Constitutional understanding that we are a God-fearing nation of laws and personal responsibilities. Those laws are both "Natural", endowed by our creator -- life, liberty, pursuit of happiness, and derived by our legal system and government by and to the extent that we, as individual citizens, entrust that power to our government. Support law enforcement, obey the laws, but always be ready to protect yourself and others in a lawful and prudent manner, if that is what is required. But never surrender or abdicate your own personal responsibilities and self-reliance, or else you voluntarily assume the role of the victim, and the victim mentality.
Praise the Lord, and pass the ammunition.
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Well said Tommy! You and I and Ted Nugent share this philosophy....I wish more Americans did. We would have less crime, and we would be a bit tougher on the problems that face our country. If it continues down the path that it is on, who knows what the new owners will do. Maybe when push comes to shove, people will once again become "We the People"...instead of "We the Sheeple".
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1. NEVER shoot unless you can explain to 12 people why you reasonably/actually feared for your life or that of another.
2. NEVER shoot once the bad guy is reteating/running unless you fear he is running to threaten another. Then Rule#1 applies again.
3. NEVER shoot in defense of property, even if the guy is stealing your car. Carjacking-in-progress may be the only exception, then #1 and #2 apply again.
4. ALWAYS retreat if possible unless retreat exposes another to harm. Then #1 and #2 apply.
5. The only property you MAY defend -- and not have to retreat -- is from inside your home or business. Even then, #1 and #2 apply again.
6. Exception tests the rule: Man stands in your front yard starting to throw a firebomb. #1, #4 , and #5 are satisfied.
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