Author Topic: Why I carry a gun  (Read 7870 times)

Offline Big_Bill

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 5615
    • http://
RE: Why I carry a gun
« Reply #15 on: March 19, 2009, 06:03:36 PM »


I don't want anyone to think that I am putting down the local Police !



If not for them, every street in every city and townwould be chaos, everyone would need to defend themselves, and lifeaswe know it could not exist.



But having been in Law Enforcement myself, the only time that the police prevent crime, is when one is stopped at a traffic light, where a criminal is stalking a victim, and is scared off by the policepresence. And the officer or officers never know how much crime that they prevented !



But most often, the police have no idea that a crime is committed until they are called, and then they do everything within their power to apprehend the criminal that committed the crime. So, if you depend on the police to protect you 24/7/365, it can't happen ! And if you remember the case where two elderly women were beaten and raped for several hours, and the one sister called the police several times, and the responding officers drove by, a few times, and saw nothing suspicious, so nothing was done to help these women. Well they survived this heinous crime, and sued the city and police department, and the court ruled that the police have no responsibility to the individual citizen ! The moral of the story is, you better be prepared to defend yourself, until the police arrive.



Now the mere announcement of you being armed, will scare off many criminals, as they don't carry very good health care, and hate to be shot ! I know,I deterred a few individuals by just opening my jacket as they approached, others need to see that you are armed before leaving, but I never needed to draw my weapon to deter their actions.



The Police perform a much required service in a society that wishes to be "civilized". Without them armed gangs would roam the streets doing whatever they desire, without much fear of being stopped. Kind of sounds like California ? But without them, it would be much, muchworse !



And while Robertand Gene arecorrect, the ramifications of shooting someone is very serious, both mentally and financially, You must decide if You would rather be Carried by 6, or judged by 12 ! It is a very difficult decision that should be veryseriouslymade !



Bill

Life Member of The United States of America
Life Member of the National Rifle Association
Member Air Guns Addicted Anonymous
SHOOT SAFE ! - SHOOT WELL ! - SHOOT OFTEN !
Always Use A Spring Compressor ! and Buy the GREAT GRT-III & CBR Triggers, cause they are GRRRREAT !

Offline dnttech

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 275
    • http://
Re: Why I carry a gun
« Reply #16 on: March 20, 2009, 12:12:10 AM »
Vinny, the first sentence of your post reflects on several members of my own department.  I swear to God some of those guys...and one womam must have been the target of bullies when they were in school.  As a field training officer of a 140 person department I get to help weed out this type of personality during the training process; however, every so often one will slip by.  Trust me, though...we do your very best to get rid of them during their first year.

Bob
Bob


Offline PelletPaul

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 508
    • http://
Re: Why I carry a gun
« Reply #17 on: March 20, 2009, 01:33:15 AM »
When criminals learn that average people like us carry guns, that in itself will deter criminal activity just like our police officers.  In Arizona the carry permits have tripled over the last year or so.  Bad guys take note of this.  Just the other day their was a home invasion and the owner shot and killed two of them.  My wife and I carry and we will defend ourselves.  If they break into our home bad things will happen to them.  My wife won't shoot a pellet gun because she prefers a .44 magnum.     Paul
FX Cyclone .22cal.6-24x44 Hawke scope  
HW97K .20cal.w/Elite 5x15x40 scope

Offline bodiej

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 337
    • http://
Re: Why I carry a gun
« Reply #18 on: March 20, 2009, 01:45:07 AM »
I vote to put that in the library!

Offline geewhiz380

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1878
    • http://
Re: Why I carry a gun
« Reply #19 on: March 20, 2009, 01:59:05 AM »
robert i live in nyc and the police r crazy out here i say about 70 % and im in the middle.i treat them with respect cause u never know when u r gonna need there help, but enough is enough this city is killing each other on a regular basis and i worry about my children cause they r great kids they go to school ,work, gym or just stay home playing games and there friends i select i really do cause i dont want to ever know my sons r involved with gangs and so far so good they have never had problems with police .no my point is i live in a high crimed area which  targets everyone from what i have seen. isnt there some type of training police get when needing to tell the difference .when people r apprehanded by cops they get scared cause cops open fire on people like if there target practicing there is alot of that going on in nyc or is it everywhere the same cause i need to move out of nyc and live in maine hopefully the police and the people get along .im 42 and in nyc cops where your friends and they play with us even knew our names and out of nowhere cops and people started shootin at each other when in reality we need each other u guys go home to a family and to a normal life y so much drama now man i wish things could change cause we r killing each other and its sad when u got to carry a gun to hurt or kill any of GODS CHILDREN I DONT HAVE GUNS BUT I HAVE AIRGUNS AND I SHOOT SAFELY UPSTATE OR MY TARGET IN MY APARTMENT 15YDS I DONT EVEN HUNT BUT WANT TO LEARN....WHAT CAN I DO ABOUT THE ABOVE SITUATION WAIT FOR ONE OF MY KIDS OR MY WIFE GET SHOOT I EVEN HAVE 4 PIT BULLS PROTECTING MY HOME ...GOD BLESS US ALL I LOVE EACH AND EVERYONE HERE WE R FAMILY .....JORGE LOPEZ ....ROBERT PRAY CAUSE ILL PRAY FOR U AND YOUR TOURS......

Offline CFX Marauder

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 953
    • http://s241.photobucket.com/albums/ff275/Cfx-131/
RE: Why I carry a gun
« Reply #20 on: March 20, 2009, 02:04:16 AM »
We had a permit holder here in Jaxcarjacked bout two weeks ago in a crowded flea market parking lot...The guy(permit holder)opened fire as the jacker fledhitting his car and several other vehicles...Almost hit a few innocents...People like him give CWP owners a bad name..I'm a firm believer that any permit holder should haveto undergotraining (not just a day at the range) with the exception of former Military/LEO..
JOIN THE NRA !! FREE Enrollment !! https://www.nrahq.org/nrabonus/accept-membership.asp
2009 Total
34 Tree Rats
10 Grackles
6 Starlings
Quote
shadow - 9/25/2008 8:00 PM  Pigeons in a dark barns, they seemed to get very alarmed by that red beam following them around. Ed
Quote
ronbeaux - 5/6/2009  10:36 PM \" Give em the lead boys and make a big hole, wanna watch em dance and steal the show\"

Offline imadogman

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 168
    • http://
Re: Why I carry a gun
« Reply #21 on: March 20, 2009, 12:43:36 PM »
Well, that post stirred things up.  I agree with much of what everyone has said about being trained properly, and that means more than just being able to hit what you are aiming at.  I wondered what kind of responses I would read, and I am not surprised by any of them.
That being said, a friend of mine once said. "If you are going to bring a weapon into the situation, be prepared to use it, otherwise you might want it to be made out of chocolate, just in case you get it fed to you."  
I know that a weapon is a great equalizer, but not so much so if you and the bad guy each have one. Also, you may want to consider that the bad guy probably has more experience than you do.  
If you think about it, a Smith and Wesson Model 29 in 44 Mag is a lot of chocolate to eat all at once.  You might choke to death if you eat it too fast, so be careful, and try to make the right decision at the right time, and sometimes running might be the best option. (unless you really like chocolate).
\"If you choose not to decide, you still have made a choice\"

\"Sailing through life at the speed of Dark\"

Offline brokenarrowjbe

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 381
    • http://
Re: Why I carry a gun
« Reply #22 on: March 20, 2009, 12:53:55 PM »
moved to bottom of thread
Chance favors the well prepared

Offline brokenarrowjbe

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 381
    • http://
Re: Why I carry a gun
« Reply #23 on: March 20, 2009, 12:54:59 PM »
Why would the bad guy have more experience than me? I practice all the time. My buddy has a shooting range set up in his back yard. The police have visited and we were told how to improve the back stop. I am not advocating the indescriminate use of firearms, but the IDPA, NRA and several other organizations are available for training. Shooting at a fleeing criminal is not OK, shooting at a threatening criminal who is not responding to the situation appropriately, ie not running away when a gun is pointed at him or her, or putting up their hands etc. I am for me being able to protect me and mine. Not sure about military experience being that great for this type of carry, I spent 10 years in the Navy and have learned more about the use of deadly force in the last 2 years than when I was in and authorized to use deadly force if neccasary. I also ussually just carry pepper spray. I don't want to kill someone over a couple of dollars, but I am not sure that everyone is willing to just take my wallet and run. At home, different story. If they are willing to come in my house, castle doctrine. John
Chance favors the well prepared

Offline Big_Bill

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 5615
    • http://
Re: Why I carry a gun
« Reply #24 on: March 20, 2009, 02:13:48 PM »


John,



All the training on the range can not prepare you for the taking of the life. Under extreme conditions, with a criminal coming at you, some will shoot the criminal, others will not be able to. The only way to find out which you are, is to be in that situation.



We are thought from our youth, thou shall not to kill ! And after you have killed someone, for any reason, you will live with a sour ball in the pit of your stomach, and the memory of that criminals face, perhaps forever. Yes you will have the memory of how justified you were, and the knowledge that you saved the life of yourself and your family, and that you did the right thing, but you will have that sour ball and memories !



So if there is any other alternative ?



Bill

Life Member of The United States of America
Life Member of the National Rifle Association
Member Air Guns Addicted Anonymous
SHOOT SAFE ! - SHOOT WELL ! - SHOOT OFTEN !
Always Use A Spring Compressor ! and Buy the GREAT GRT-III & CBR Triggers, cause they are GRRRREAT !

Offline brokenarrowjbe

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 381
    • http://
Re: Why I carry a gun
« Reply #25 on: March 20, 2009, 02:29:53 PM »
Bill, we may have different views on this. If getting rid of guns was a useful solution I would be all for i. But that is not the solution or even a good idea. Hitler would be the poster child for why gun control is a bad idea. Some times hard decisions have to be made. I believe it is best to practice and be prepared. I am sure the taking of a human life is not the same as deciding what is for dinner. However, being willing to allow criminals the ability to act with impunity is also not Ok with me. The debate here is not how I would feel but about training, preparation and proper tools for the job. If I am ever in a position to need to decide, better I have practiced, thought about, and made the decision based on my and my family's need for safety rather than overreacting out of fear and not understanding my options fully. I was not taght thou shall not kill. So, we will have to disagree on that. Hopefully I will never need to find out. But if it becomes necassary, chance favors the well prepared. John
Chance favors the well prepared

Offline Timmyj1959@yahoo.com

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3716
    • http://dragonslayer
Re: Why I carry a gun
« Reply #26 on: March 20, 2009, 02:58:01 PM »
Quote
Big_Bill - 3/20/2009 7:13 PM

John,



All the training on the range can not prepare you for the taking of the life. Under extreme conditions, with a criminal coming at you, some will shoot the criminal, others will not be able to. The only way to find out which you are, is to be in that situation.



We are thought from our youth, thou shall not to kill ! And after you have killed someone, for any reason, you will live with a sour ball in the pit of your stomach, and the memory of that criminals face, perhaps forever. Yes you will have the memory of how justified you were, and the knowledge that you saved the life of yourself and your family, and that you did the right thing, but you will have that sour ball and memories !



So if there is any other alternative ?



Bill

Very WELL said Uncle Bill. JUSTIFIED or not,,,,,,, you WILL live with it the rest of your life. You WILL find yourself asking yourself,,, "what if" MANY thousands of times for the rest of your life. WORD. Even if it is justified,,,,,you will think about it EVERY DAY for the rest of your life,,,, it NEVER goes away. years later,,, it will still seem like just yesterday it happened. You can never fully recover. You just learn to live with it. Tim. There are alternatives,,, unless you are facing a gun??

Offline CaptGeorge

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 228
    • http://
Re: Why I carry a gun
« Reply #27 on: March 20, 2009, 03:06:25 PM »
Great discussion. I'm not in law enforcement, however, I've ridden along with my son-in-law when he was an officer. It's a scary place out there at 2am in almost every city or town regardless of size.  I have the utmost respect for all law enforcement - especially patrol officers.  I have also worked with local government and police in Emergency Management. I've even been in JAIL - as a VISITOR, of course, on a tour with our Chief of Police.

Here's my take on the entire situation.  Everyone should join their local Police Support Citizen's Groups.  Some towns even have a Citizens Police Academy.  If possible, arrange a ride-along with a patrol officer one night.  You'll be surprised what you see in your "safe" little town at 2am in the morning on the weekend.  Then arrange to actually visit your local city or county jail.  You'll find plenty of "interesting" people there.  Then you can decide the best way to protect yourself and family.

I don't want to start any religious or moral arguments.  However, the original Hebrew text reads:  Thy shall not MURDER. Murder is a lot different than KILL.

Offline Big_Bill

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 5615
    • http://
Re: Why I carry a gun
« Reply #28 on: March 20, 2009, 04:06:51 PM »


Hello John,



I do not remember saying to hand in your guns ! ButI will say, if put to the task, you may not be able to do it ! If you announce to the criminal that you have called the police, and are armed, 90% of criminals will leave quickly. They never want to break into a residence that has an armed homeowner, they want an easy safe job. If your faced with one of the remaining 10%, you may find out if you can take a life.



All that I am saying is to be prepared for the worse, but do what you feel is possible to deter the situation from ending poorly.



Get the drop on the perp as he comes up the stairs, or enters the room, scream (with a commanding voice)for him to hit the floor ! Put your hands behind you head ! Be prepared tofire if your commands are not responded to. But if responded to, keep away from the perp, and keep you gun on him while your wife calls the police, if she hasn't already. And Watch the Perp carefully, as he may be armed...but always be prepared !!!!! and Careful !



I guard my family and home, I have guns, and I have no doubt of what I will be able to do, if the situation demands it. But I will do it as a last resort ! I do have that sour ball in the pit of my stomach. And I know it only gets bigger !



Bill

Life Member of The United States of America
Life Member of the National Rifle Association
Member Air Guns Addicted Anonymous
SHOOT SAFE ! - SHOOT WELL ! - SHOOT OFTEN !
Always Use A Spring Compressor ! and Buy the GREAT GRT-III & CBR Triggers, cause they are GRRRREAT !

Offline imadogman

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 168
    • http://
Re: Why I carry a gun
« Reply #29 on: March 20, 2009, 04:29:16 PM »


John, I think that you missed my point about experience. You stated "Why would the bad guy have more experience than me? I practice all the time."



When I stated that the criminal might have more experience than you do, I meant that he probably had more experience at being an unethical, immoral, thoughtless and uncaring %$#*&. He might also have more experience shooting at human beings, and he may never shoot at paper targets because they don't bleed, and he can't get another teardrop tatoo if he shoots one.



Will he or shehave more experience at being a ruthless killer? I would think that might be a possibility too, since most people have never killed anyone.



I applaud you for training and practicing, but how will you react in a bad situation??? I don't know what I would do, although I have played it out in my mind a few times. (Usually right after some nutcase shoots up a place full of innocent and unarmed people.) I think that I know what I would do, but until it happens (God forbid), I won't really know. I think that my lifestyle keeps me out of places where many of these kinds of things happen, but who knows if or when someone might just want to enter my home and take something, or cause me harm. I am prepared for that...at least as prepared as I can be. Not sure how things might turn out if I am awakened from a deep sleep with little or no time to react.



There are other things that we can do at home to protect ourselves. Thieves don't like lights or alarms, and a big dog that barks loudly at intruders is a wonderful thing. A little forethought might prevent an altercation.



Good luck!

\"If you choose not to decide, you still have made a choice\"

\"Sailing through life at the speed of Dark\"