Hey all!! / need some rimfire advice :)

[michael90t]

Pretty much agree with everything Redfeather said there....

I have a model 60 my pops bought me prolly 23 years ago or so.... has had a ton of ammo (I would honestly say somewhere in the area of 10,000 rounds if not a bit more..) through it and is still a little tack driver... does get cruddy pretty fast but then every autoloader I have ever shot does so... trigger is good but not much you can do to it besides some carefull stoning and polishing....

10/22 great little rifle not as good right out of the box but if you like to hotrod well they make everything under the sun for these beasts and if you can dream it, it can probably be built on this action....

no experiance with the cz's but they make good stuff and you hear good reviews about them so prolly cant go wrong with one

And then also have to add another vote for the Thompson Center rifles.... like dad says he has both the benchmark and the hunter... the Benchmark is capable of some EXTREME accuracy and I mean extreme! think dad has a couple targets hanging on the wall he shot I will take some pics and post them next time I am over there... but its a finicky beast with its match cut chamber....

the hunter is probably the most accurate "normal" autoloader I have seen.... its honestly not far behind the benchmark and really seems to be reliable.. normal chamber but its held to some pretty tight specs....

[onemountain]

first off, thanks to those who reminded me of the take-down .22s. They certainly look handy as lightweight, compact guns. I especially like the papoose.

A backpacking rifle to me is to be used to supplement the food supply I carry in, whether as a matter of choice (dehydrated stuff gets old fast) or necessity (survival). This is why .22 is good- you can take a body shot on a small critter without necessarily destroying a lot of meat.

Which brings up .17 HMR and .17 HM2.

.17 HMR seems a bit much to me for shooting critters for the purposes of eating them, having seen what it does to smaller critters with body shots.

Now, it ain't gonna fly here to say "so just shoot 'em in the head!" Maybe I'll be cold and shivering, maybe the intermittent tremor I have in my hands will be bad, maybe I'll injured and just not able to hold very steady- I'm not going to assume I can always make headshots, so whatever cartridge I use needs to be ok for body shots.

This brings up .17 HMR gamepoints. Are these ok for something rabbit sized (maybe smaller??) for body shots? Or are they still too destructive? I don't know anyone who has used them.

And that in turn brings up .17 HM2. Would a .17 HM2 gamepoint be permissible on small critters with body shots?

the .17 caliber rimfires seem to be great for in the field hunting for food IF they aren't too destructive with body shots. (Who wouldn't want a nice, flat trajectory, eh?) Soooo, how do they do with body shots with those fancy li'l gamepoints? I'm probably talking under 100 yds here too.

Thanks in advance (again) folks.

BTW, if you have any rifle suggestions in the spirit of this thread before this post, go ahead and feel free to share them. This isn't meant to terminate the first half of this thread.

[joe-joe guns]

I have my favorite cause it's the one I own and nobody's mentioned it.........Springfield Armory M6 scout  I don't have a link but googled it and got a bunch of links.Breaks down with one quick pin,built in ammo storage,dual caliber and you can fire it with gloves on.Good enough for the US Air Force is good for me.

[Jerrycup]

TCups has one of those. IIRC, it can swap barrels and shoot .410 shotgun shells. It was labeled Springfield Armory, but was made by CZ. Looks pretty functional (read that ugly as sin) and I would guess it could be a great survivalist tool. Is this gun still in production?

Tommy can tell us how it shoots...

[shady816]

hi onemountain    i shoot a 17hmr all the time, mine is the savage bvss and i have taken just about every small critter under the sun with it and the 17 grain vmax hornady do not have a whole lot of devistation under 100 yards. the bullet is still traveling to fast for great expansion on rabbit/ squirrel size critters but foxes coyotes and such with large enough bones the 21 grain vmax will nearly decapitate them with good shot placement and remember you can buy 100 rounds of .22 for what it cost for 50 rounds of .17

[TCups]

Springfield Armory no longer makes the M6 (or imports them -- mine was actually made by CZ).  You can find them used -- at a premium (Holy Cow!!).

The Springfield Armory site does make a nice ballistic nylon case for the survival rifle.  And by adding various 22S, L, LR rounds and both 410 ga. shot shells and rifled slugs, it becomes pretty darned versatile.  Anywhere from "stealth plinker" with CCI CB Shorts or Longs, to "deerslayer" with a rifled 410 slug.  I keep about 4 different boxes of 22LR ammo and one box or 410 shells in the nylon case, along with the loads stored in the rifle's stock compartment.

http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.aspx?Item=163435937

http://www.oldjimbo.com/survival/v-shrake/m6.html

http://www.springfield-armory.com/store/index.php?main_page=index&cPath=23

[airiscool]

17 vs 22 cal ?

If it was me...

22 ammo costs less, has more choices of ammo types and weights, and more places to buy it from. Slower, heavier 22 is less likely to be deflected shooting in brush where the critters are most likely to be.

And...does the gun you want even come in 17 cal ?

Paul.

[shady816]

i like the t-cups contraption if you can get the 410 slugs out of it now your chances of servival just got better.

[airiscool]

Is the CZ version as heavy as the original Springfield version

If so, the Papoose is over a pound lighter.  It's light weight (3-1/4 lbs) combined with the ability for a quick follow up shot is why my backpacking former employee chose it over any other survival type rifle.

Paul.

[TCups]

Not sure . . .   Mine is blued, actually probably Parkerized -- a matte black finish.  I suspect it may be lighter than the stainless steel version, but I don't know.  I suppose I could GUOMA and weigh the rifle for you.  I think I am going to follow the example in the survivalist post and wrap mine in some paracord too.  I like the ideal of putting fire starting equipment in an empty shot shell, too.

 . . .

4.5 pounds with a full load of 15 x 22LR's and 4x410 shells.  It also occurred to me that perhaps a Fenix LD01 flashlight might fit in one of the 410 slots -- it won't.  But it will surely fit nicely into one of the sleeves of an elastic shell holder on the side of the stock.

And compared to all the other "survival" rifles, the extra pound of weight for the 410 barrel and receiver is a good trade off, IMO.  I can probably feed myself a lot easier adding a shotgun to a 22LR -- wing shots are now a possibility.  And a 3/4ths OZ 410 slug is pretty potent, too.

[shady816]

is yours the pack away in the stock survival rifle?

[TCups]

No -- it folds, or with removal of one hinge pin, it breaks down into two pieces.  The firing pin can be positioned to shoot either the 410 or the 22LR or put in a middle "safe" position.  I suppose it could be carried pretty safely with both chambers loaded.  The rear sight filps from a V-notch (410) to peep sight (22LR).  I have shot the .22LR and the 410 with #7.5 shot, but I am negligent as I have not sighted in with 410 slugs, which is something I should definitely do.

[joe-joe guns]

I have the stainless springfield version..22 and 410. when I bought the place had a mountain of them 199.00 out the door blued or stainless.You also had the option of .22 mag with a .45,I wish I would have bought a few before I couldn't,but at least I got one.Don't forget the built in sling mounts.

[jay morgan]

hey mr. onemountan back too what you asked,A 17 runs out of speed at 100 yds(lite bullet you know)still effecetive but runs low on power,Ive been told not good on kills beyond that? I really think you will be better off with 22 & yes a 17 up close is very destructive on meat(body shot a treerat & you better like head stew). TAKE CARE SIR.

[jay morgan]

MY other 2 cents , if you like the idea of the 22 /410 the above posts are talking about, look at an old stevens drilling gun a term for over& under,break open 22 on top 410 lower barrell, & I believe they are still made by someone can't remember who(getting old & forgetful),I think in .22mag & 20ga. also?