Spring twang... how to cure?

[CharlieDaTuna]

There's your problem. You need to start from scratch. I had a feeling that was the case and it's not the first time it has come up to me. And if you added the needle bearing thrust bearing in the piston, I highly suggest you get that out also or you might find that your gun is trashed. Hopefully you didn't use his guide and if so, you should get the stock guide and replace it.  Maccari's E-1500 is a drop in spring.  Use the small Apex seal and get his heavy tar and the moly.

No I dont have the needle bearing. wheew..... I figured that spring would be alot more than $17.00 Think I might just get one this friday along with the seal and some lubes.

Thanks bob

Its not a bad price to fix this and make it shoot harder. But honestly as of now the gun is shooting about 830 with superdomes and its smooth. Just a nice thud and the pellet comes out. I might just leave it alone for a few weeks and see how it goes.

thanks everyone !!

CharlieDaTuna - 8/22/2007  8:16 PM

There's your problem. You need to start from scratch. I had a feeling that was the case and it's not the first time it has come up to me. And if you added the needle bearing thrust bearing in the piston, I highly suggest you get that out also or you might find that your gun is trashed. Hopefully you didn't use his guide and if so, you should get the stock guide and replace it.  Maccari's E-1500 is a drop in spring.  Use the small Apex seal and get his heavy tar and the moly.

Woops did I screw up ordering E-2000 springs for the 440?

Cheers
Mark
Sometimes too stupid to ask before ordering....

[CharlieDaTuna]

Maybe..maybe not. It depends on your ability. The tophat may be a problem. Let me give you some specs to relate to:

Spring           Coils           wire dia.                coil bound                    tophat thickness

Gamo Stk     34-35            .119                       4.165                          .380
E-1500              35           .120                       4.200
E-2000              36           .125                       4.500

The maximun coil bind allowable is 4.650.

As you can see, the maximum tophat thickness that you can use with the E-2000 is about .150. Unless your gun has the light tophat (and most likely doesn't as most 440's have the large tophat) which has a thickness of 2.5mm or approximatly .100, you will need to modify the tophat and/or the spring block (not the best approach but necessary). You really should also allow about .125 or an additioal .075 for cocking and spring error.



Hope this helps

Thats good to hear, making a top hat is no problem.  It shoots so well out of the box with just your trigger though I'm in no hurry to tear into it.

Cheers
Mark

Hey Bob, out of curosity whats the strongest spring I can install into the shadow? Was that JM spring about as strong as it gets or is there something else that can fit with some minor work?

[davee1]

Looks like somethins wrong, I was just reading this thread and I got a feeling of dread. I have a Shadow1000 .177. I wanted to give it a little more power so I could shoot Tomahawks and CPHeavies at the theoretical stability limit which I figure is about 1000~1090fps. Back in the middle of July, dummy me, I was reading a thread over on the Yellow forum, and ended up emailin a guy named Rich from Mich. Now, I found out that the kit that he offered for the S1K contained the JM E2000, but it also contained a needlebearing thrust washer(s). The needlebearing thrust washer, while a novel idea, just didn't sit well with me. So I ordered up some springs, seals, and lubes from old JM himself. I ordered 2 E2000 springs so that I could use one in my S1K and maybe use the other in my Hammerli or something else, or at least have a spare layin' around to "experiment with". Ok, so that was the background info to cover up my stupidity for listening to some guys over on the yellow forum, :-) and that was before I know what I know now, and that is to take any advice from the yellow forum with a grain of salt...because so far, none of the advice that I picked up over there turned out to be good advice.

So...now I've got this E2000 spring, and from what I understand reading through this thread is that the tophat will need to be modified or a new one made, which I can do, but it still bugs me.The E2000 spring is not just a drop in for the S1K. It's the E1500 that you could drop right in, *but* you losepower in a tradeoff for shot smoothness and consistency. Did I get all that right?

And believe it or not...I'm not worried about twang or vibration. I just want my S1K to shoot a little faster, and I've got the GRT3 trigger coming.

[CharlieDaTuna]

Dave... the difference in power is very little and the velocity change will only be about 20 fps or so. The E-1500 in my opinion is a bit smoother shooting but the ID is a bit bigger and keep in mind that I make fitted guides for the TurboTunes and that includes about 95% of the Gamo's that I do. The E-2000 does fit the factory guide a little better as it has a .518 ID where the E-2000 has an ID of .530.  It's a bit of a trade off but not enough to be concerned about and worth it. I would take performance over velocity any day within reason.

The Tarantula also has a .530 as well as a .128 wire diameter and why it is not recommended for use in the Gamo as a rule unless you have the capability to machine fitted spring guides and top hats. That being said, many do use the Tarantula when it's available anyhow but give up performance and they can fatigue a little early and also cant.. If you do have the capabilities and can do it, the Tarantula is an excellent spring to use.

[CharlieDaTuna]

I'm not real sure if there is a stronger well performing JM spring than the Tarantula (see the response above)  or the E-2000  with the  E-1500 a close second. I've never been one that tunes for power (nor do most any other pro springer tuners) and usually decline tune requests from those that want power tunes. Usually the customer is not happy when he gets it back because the loss of performance. I just don't do them and is why you for the most part hear nothing but good about my tunes. To me consistency and accuracy are far more important than power.

[davee1]

CharlieDaTuna - 8/26/2007 6:34 AM Dave... the difference in power .......... The E-2000 does fit the factory guide a little better as it has a .518 ID where the E-2000 has an ID of .530. It's a bit of a trade off but not enough to be concerned about and worth it.

Bob, I'm confused, thanks for your reply, but your'e referring to the E2000 twice with different numbers. Which one is which? I'm hopin that what you are sayin here is that the E2000 does fit the factory guide ok, and can be dropped in with no mods?

I also bought a universal firewire spring, to see what that would fit in...what do you think of those(not for a S1K).