Well guys...here I am sittin on the fence....

[davee1]

I have been slowly approachingPCP rifles. This is one thing that I would like to do right. Since I have never even held or fired a PCP, I feel no buying compulsion. But its looking more and more like I'm gonna have to go with something a lot quieter than my Diana 350M springer. "Someone" called the cops. I now need to be very discreet if I am going to have any fun.

So...here's a chance to recommend an excellent setup to a guy who already knows how to shoot. I've got scopemounts and scopes, I just wanna find out what rifle and equipment to go with. I need something that will take out ground squirrels to skunks, preferrably in .22, since I already have loads of medium/heavy pellets in that cal.

I read down the page and saw a recommendation from Kirby and then that guy ended up blowing off Kirby's advice andended up buying a BAM51. I can assure you that I *will not* be doing that. When it comes to PCP, it is my belief that there is plenty of better products on the market than BAM. While I have some springers made by them and I love to tinker, for now I am interested in purchasing a rifle that will shoot well out of the box without tuning it.

So what do you guys think?

By the way, what kind of advances in electric filling pump technology are out there? Is there an affordable one yet?

[3n00n]

I don't havea Mac1 Sumatrabut I do have a couple of other air guns he has tuned, and the Career 9mmultra consistantly prints 60m 6 shotgroups that can be covered with a dime.

If you are able to make out the little steel buuny at 135 yards in the picture, that is what the Mac1 9mm was hitting 9 for 10 shots on a 2700 psi fill. Same aim, the 10th shot would hit just low. For reference the white squares are 12"x12" steel sighters usedat AAF 2005 in Lavon, Tx on Boyd's farm. That is another fun story . . .

`

Anyway, the Mac1 Sumatra is really closein priceto 'anyone' else for a 'from the factory' gun, just significantly improved by Tim. You can probably even set up an appt. to see Tim since you are just a few hours from Los Angeles. It is always best to call and speak with Tim when possible and just remember that he isn't real big on 'tire kicker' or 'nit picker' types, but when you get ready for quietaccuracy Mac1 knows how to build them. If you find a good used one he can go through that for a reasonable'service tune' fee.

`

{an' git off the fence before ya gits splinters}

[davee1]

I have always looked at sumatras with awe. They have *got* to be one helluva rifle. I wonder if Tim would consider me as a tire kicker? :-)

[kirby999]

The best and quietest deal out there that I know of is the AA S400C in 22. from Pyramyd air . http://www.pyramydair.com/cgi-bin/model.pl?model_id=181 You can get it in .22 and that one should be adjustable power with a shroud. they are out of stock ,but expect a shipment next month. If you order now , when the shipment comes in they will honor the price ; if you wait they may go up. I was told by their customer service that they would be shrouded . With a shrouded adjustable carbine in .22 you can turn down the power for back yard use and you won't believe how quiet it is . You can get one in .177 , 12fpe now in stock .  At $555.30 and with the 10% off coupon code , you can get one for right at $500 . Pumps that would be required would be very expensive (to me anyway) ; you'd be better off buying a used scuba tank at your local scuba shop. The only other accessory you would need is the yolk , hose and gauge set-up. (about $75) If you order one; order over the phone and get the Customer service lady  to verify that the rifle is "shrouded". A shrouded 12 fpe .177 would be pretty quiet. The .22 cal AA S410H Classic on low power was whisper quiet but it was only going about 400fps. As I turned up the power the sound went up but around 600fps it was still pretty quiet , then I could turn it up when hunting and get 950fps , but I didn't shoot it much in the backyard at that power.  kirby

[davee1]

Thanks man...hey, but can you give me an example of an electric pump that you would buy, without regard to cost?

[kirby999]

Here you go and don't forget the 10% coupon http://www.pyramydair.com/cgi-bin/accessory.pl?accessory_id=326 kirby

[davee1]

hehe...yep I see what you mean about it being expensive. But you know, there was a time when both my wife and I were working, and I would have snatched this pump up in a heartbeat.

Another good option is the FX range of PCP's. My Typhoon has taken rabbits at 120m. It is also known with a Walnut stock as the Logun Solo. The Monsoon is semi auto with a full shroud and is very guiet at full power. FX also do a compressor unit. Might even be the one Kirby linked.

[davee1]

Thanx, I'll check it out, sounds really powerful. I like that. hehe

[davee1]

Whoa...what about this one? Its only 650 bucks!!!

http://www.bauerpaintball.com/Products/fillpanel_pitboss.htm

[davee1]

looks like there's another one at pyramyd now, even more expensive.

http://www.pyramydair.com/cgi-bin/accessory.pl?accessory_id=1999

[johncedarhill]

In my limited experience, I would recommend a carbon graphite tank from Air Hog listed in the mall. Your biggest question to answer is whether or not there is a local dive shop or someone who can fill to 4500 psi. If you want to travel with your gun you may still have to consider getting a tank anyway. The Air Hog guys are good to deal with and there system is easy to use. It comes with a scuba din connector and a whip. You can fill scuba at any dive shop even if they do not go to 4500. The various connections can be confusing very confusing. You can get everything you need out of the box. When I looked into this and the used stuff etc. I concluded that a new tank which does not need a hydro for five years and has a fifteen year life was the lowest cost per year way to go over the life of the tank.  They also have all the probes etc you will need. I have a hand pump and believe me that is not the way to go if you want to do any amount of shooting. I also considered the compressor but then I thought about maintenance and repair etc. THe carbon graphite tank for me turned out to be the best option. I did look at another vendor but for various reasons I chose Air Hog and I am glad I did.

[jon]

Scuba tanks fills are not nearly as complicated as it seems,  an electric compressor is really not needed, it would take thousands of fills to re-coup costs.  I own 2 scuba tanks and have never run out if air yet.  One is a 3,000 PSI and the other is a 3,300 PSI and the dive shop is more than willing to fill both ofthese tanks well past the rated pressure.

Take some time and talk to your local shop owner it really helps, it wouldn't hurt to buy some equipment from him or her either.  Between both of my "regular" tanks I can get almost 100 fills.  That's about 4,000 shots for only $14.  I have a total investment of $300 bucks into both tanks and the fill set-up.  Carbon fiber tanks are great but the cost of a new set-up from airhog is downright highway robbery.

By the way I have a nice Air Arms 400 classic for $525+25 shipping, Kirby can vouch for the rifle's condition and accuracy.

[3n00n]

$35 a fill for a 550cu.in. tank holding 88cu.ft. of 4500psi air at a dive shop, 100 fills more than pays for a good compressor and tank.

`

Stewart Warner setup is$1600.00 from ProTec Air~ so even with a tank {or 2} and with the massive dessicant dryerpack on it, I'm way ahead of the game for the approximately 120 fills from just over 9 hours of run time.

$35 x 120 = $4200 by my math

`

$600 tank with carrier kitand fittings from Airhog

$2200 Pro Tec compressor with dryer,dessicant, oiland fittings

$12for 4 gallons of premium gasoline

$2812

`

Looks like $1388 fill chargessaved from skipping all of thosetrips to the dive shop.

Maybe I'll go get a DAQ

The compressor should be good for many moreyears into the future.

[jon]

100 gun fills, understand what I'm saying?  For me 100 gun re-fills is 4,000 shots for $14

If you have air gusslers like DAQ's and Korean guns I could see why one would want a compressor.  But for the average 30 FPE .22's they are far from essential equipment.

The standard scuba tank gets a bad rap, there are many sizes and fill pressures and not to mention an aluminum or steel tank will outlast your interest in airguns most times.