Author Topic: Match #2  (Read 18630 times)

Offline ac12basis

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Re: Match #2
« Reply #30 on: February 12, 2009, 02:52:29 PM »
TC
You can see that yellow at 10m????
You got GOOD eyes.

I just checked, the black on the Gamo out thru the 6 ring is about 60mm, that is 2x the diameter of the black on an ISSF 10m AR target (30.5mm).
I think I'm goina have to switch to a larger front insert, to accomodate the larger bull.

Offline Big_Bill

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RE: Match #2
« Reply #31 on: February 12, 2009, 02:52:32 PM »


Gosh Tommy !!!!!



What have you been eaten ? Shootin groups like that, that's some shootin there !



Beautiful shootin buddy ! Your making me start to turn green again, and you know it aint easy being green !



Lookin forward to seeing you in the match,,,,I think ???

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Offline TCups

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RE: Match #2
« Reply #32 on: February 12, 2009, 03:15:33 PM »
Charlotte:

I fear if I get down to shoot in the prone position, I will have to have someone help me get back up (unless I can shoot prone from my bed or the couch).  And how am I going to cock that single pumper side arm when  I am prone?  Can't we just shoot standing or sitting?  And I would like to shoot matches on the 5-bull 10 meter Edelmann targets, too, so I don't have to keep putting the rifle down and walking over to replace the target every 5 shots.

Offline daved

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Re: Match #2
« Reply #33 on: February 12, 2009, 04:37:47 PM »
You're killing me, Tommy, there's a very nice Diana 75 TO1 for sale on the Yellow right now for $525, it's been there awhile, and the price keeps coming down.  Can't understand why no one has snapped it up, I'm trying to figure out how to convince my wife that I NEED a vintage 10M match rifle.  As you might suspect, I'm not having much luck :-).  

So the extra weight makes that much difference, huh?  I though it was just stock design, much as I love my Cyclone, it's not nearly as good as the S200 for off hand shooting.  Your comment about the 853 has me thinking, I've been considering carving a new stock for mine, more like the 753 or even my S200 in design.  But if weight helps, maybe I'll make it out of Ipe, a very heavy, hard tropical hardwood.  Think double the weight of black walnut, but very similar in look and grain structure.  I still don't understand it, but despite all the issues I have with that rifle at the moment, every time I pick it up I seem to hit what I'm shooting at.  Can't wait for my rebuild kit and new front sight to get here.  Later.

Dave

Offline ac12basis

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Re: Match #2
« Reply #34 on: February 12, 2009, 07:11:02 PM »
Dave
The weight of the rifle helps to dampen the "wobble" of a shooter.
The idea is physics, it takes more effort to move more mass.  So with a heavier rifle, body wobble is dampened.  
To see this compare a heavy and light rifle, and you will see that you can shoot a heavier rifle better, but you don't want to carry one very far.  Hence the compromise for a hunting rifle.

BUT the location of the center of gravity also has an effect on barrel wobble reduction.
Target rifles have muzzle weight to move the CG forward to better dampen the barrel wobble.

If you make a stock for target shooting, make it like the 753, with a vertical pistol grip.
You also want the forestock to be deeper, so there is more depth so it will be easier for your forward arm to hold it up.
Look at pictures of target rifles for ideas.

Offline TCups

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Re: Match #2
« Reply #35 on: February 12, 2009, 08:40:34 PM »
Inertia - the property that tends to keep moving bodies in motion and bodies at rest motionless.  The greater the mass (weight) of an air rifle, the more energy it takes to overcome the inertia and start it in motion again, once it has come to rest. The heavier the rifle, the better you will eventually become at holding it absolutely motionless for the critical fraction of a second it takes to fire accurately.

I don't perceive that the COG of the Walther has been moved forward very much.  Rather, it seems the barrel weight is more to balance the overall weight of the rifle and off-set the weight of the heavier German walnut stock, but perhaps I am wrong.  

Shooting with a padded glove on my right hand (I shoot LH) seems to help.  I use an old weight lifter's glove rather than a true target shooting glove.  

Raising the front and rear sights with 2 cm Anschutz risers, spacing out the stock 2 cm, and dropping the rear recoil pad 2 cm means I can bring this rifle to a firm cheek weld just under the zygoma (cheekbone) without bending my neck to one side, and with the diopter sights lined up in the center of my visual field with my neck and shoulder completely relaxed.  Every other rifle I own requires some degree of bending my neck or "hunching up" my shoulder a bit, or both, to line up the sights properly.  For critical target shooting, any tension in the neck or shoulder is a bad thing.

If you are serious about learning how to shoot off hand as well as you possibly can, then,  1) buy a copy of "The Ways of the Rifle" -- best money you will ever spend on the hobby of target shooting -- and, 2) make sure your rifle "fits" perfectly.  To my friend J. Woodcock, I say "thank you" for pointing out both of these truths to me early on, just when I started to get hooked on air rifles, and for pointing me toward the Walter LGR-U and encouraging me to take the leap.  This was my very first target rifle and my very first dedicated LH stocked air rifle (big step for a right-hander).

And as for that 10-meter rifle on the "yellow", go for it!  In my opinion (an amateur who has been non-competitively target shooting air rifles less than a year) my attempt to master a 10-meter air rifle has taught me more about the sport of shooting than anything else I have learned the previous 50-some-odd years.  Of all the air rifles I own, my Walther is probably be the last I would ever consider selling.

Offline airgunandy

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RE: Match #2
« Reply #36 on: February 12, 2009, 11:17:30 PM »
What about Creedmore? At 10 meters?  :)

Offline riflejunkie

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Re: Match #2
« Reply #37 on: February 12, 2009, 11:53:40 PM »


Good job pointing out that the book "The Ways of The Rifle" is worth having. The way I look at it is this, shooting is my love. For me, it replaced prozac. When I'm shooting, all my problems and distractions just go away and there is nothing else in my universe but sight alignment and trigger control. I have my limits on what I can spend, but just to give you my perspective two nights ago my daughter and I went out for drinks. I had an Irish coffee and she had 2 double Jamesons and the bill was $29. The time spent including driving was about 2 hours and I can't put a price on time spent with my 12 year oldbut that is nearly the price of a brick of rimfire practice ammo which would last me about 3 weekends. It's more than the cost of a box of CPL's and how long will that last? For what they are, the Walther, FWB300 and even the 753/853 Daisy Avanti are relatively cheap entertainment. The cost of targets and pellets and maybe a nice bookon shooting are pretty small when you think about what you will spend going to a movie or out for a couple of drinks. The Gamo targets are $5 for a hundred. The 12 bull 10 meter targets are about $12 for a hundred. I drink alcohol very infrequently, so everytime I spend money on it I'm thinking "I could have spent this money on shooting and I'd be happier." Live a little.

Daisy 853 with apertures; FWB 300S with apertures; Mike Melick tuned B-26 and B-40.
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Offline TCups

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Re: Match #2
« Reply #38 on: February 13, 2009, 12:55:27 AM »
I suspect we are in the "Golden Age" of air gunning.  And I fear there will come a time, perhaps soon, when Americans will not be able to just go on line and order up a fine air rifle.   And consider what the prices of formerly "inexpensive" firearms have done over the years.  For example, I think I gave less than $300 for my M1A 7.62 mm some years ago, before Clinton tried to ban them - price one now!  IMO, if you think you might ever want to own and shoot a fine target air rifle, now is a good time to jump.  When all this Monopoly money being printed by the government causes inflation to kick in (and it will, soon, with a vengence), then a quality $500-750 target rifle is going to be unobtainable.

Offline ac12basis

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Re: Match #2
« Reply #39 on: February 13, 2009, 05:42:07 AM »
re shooting glove
The shooting glove is only ONE glove, for the support hand (under the forestock).  What seems to always get confusing is; right-handers use a left hand glove (left hand is under the forestock), and left-handers use a right hand glove.  
The glove only needs to be padded; to protect your knuckles (if you rest the rifle on the knuckles) or to isolate the rifle from your blood pulse (if you rest the rifle on the palm).
To that end any glove with enough padding the appropriate place will do.  Example, to protect my knuckles, an old ski glove would work fine.
For those that shoot w the rifle on the knuckles, that padding is important. I hurt my knuckles early on, because I was using an old work glove that did not have any padding (didn't know any better back then), and that 11 pound rifle resting on 2 knuckles really did a number on them.
Of course if you can, just get a shooting glove.  You don't need the most expensive one.

re support
Speaking of shooting glove, there is another item that those of you with a 10m match rifle should use.  This is a BACK BELT.
Does not have to be expensive, mine is from Home Depot.
The back belt will support your lower back while in the shooting position.  And this becomes important when you are holding an 11 pound match rifle, vs a lightweight sportster rifle.
10m match shooters wear an "outfit" of which a shooting jacket is a part of.  The jacket provides support to the back.  w/o the jacket, you have no extra support, hence the recommendation of a back belt.
note:  A back belt is NOT legal in sanctioned 10m matches.  But for casual home use, protect your back and use the back belt.

re  Ways of the Rifle
I wish I had that book when I started 10m AR.  
While a coach is important, that book is the next best thing to having a coach.
It is hard to shoot well or improve when you have no idea what you are doing right and wrong.

re muzzle weight
I put one on my rifle and it made a big difference, to me.  w/o the weight, the muzzle had more movement (wobble).  
Same idea of inertia, but specifically for the front sight/muzzle.
Thats why when you look at many of the target rifles you see that big muzzle weight out front.  Take it off and the rifle becomes harder to hold on target.

Offline TCups

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RE: Match #2 Score 188
« Reply #40 on: February 13, 2009, 07:26:55 AM »
Got up early this morning (around 430A) so I could finish up the office before noon and have this afternoon to shoot.  I tweaked the rear iris and diopter sight some and even put in my contact lenses.  I set up my tripod and moved the felt-lined pie tin to the top of the tripod to act as a pellet tray and a place to prop up the Walther when I changed out the targets.  This turns out to work great for indoor target shooting -- out the bedroom door, down the hall, and into the "junk room". Shooting the Walther LGR-U / 177 single pump pneumatic with Vogel "Greens", indoors at 10 meters (33 ft) measured, I shot about 25 practice rounds and then scored the following 5 scores on 100 consecutive shots:  183, 180, 179, 179, 188.  Here is my 188 score, posted to give you guys something to shoot at.  Damned if I didn't shoot the 8, then the 7 as the first two shots of the last group!  I was already counting up my score. I just knew I would break 190 (LOL).  Anyway,  then I re-doubled my efforts and shot the last three 10's.   I think I will take a nap now and get ready for dinner tonight with my sweetie.  Good luck all!


PS:  Ronbeaux - Look! No yellow hilighter!  You are on your own, bro.  No excuses.

Offline Truman

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RE: Match #2 Score 188
« Reply #41 on: February 13, 2009, 09:09:10 AM »
Looks like we're getting a bit serious on this one! Think I'll get out the special shooting hat for tomorrow!
cuiusvis hominis est errare, nullius nisi insipientis in errore perseverare.

Offline ronbeaux

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RE: Match #2 Score 188
« Reply #42 on: February 13, 2009, 09:23:16 AM »
Tremendous! I just finished my multi pump match for posting. That is as soon as I get the ice pack off my arm!!

Offline Truman

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Re: Match #2
« Reply #43 on: February 13, 2009, 10:58:18 PM »
Well after a morning without coffee and cigs, I went down to the range to shoot match#2! With a little breeze going across the range, I got the Gamo out of it's bag. A few breathing exercises later and I was up to the plate! I was determined this time to get a good score! All the time, Charlottes words were running through my head! I closed my eyes and took a few breaths, opened them and the target was nowhere to be seen! A quick adjustment of the feet and eyes closed again! This time, I was in the ball park! First shot on the 6-7 line, bugger! After that, I settled down and was happy with my shooting until shot eleven when I changed for a new target! First shot on that target got me a 4-5 line, bugger again! Composure Andy, composure!! After that flier, I settled again and finished the match! Next week will be better I thought lighting up the first cig and pouring myself a coffee from the flask!
cuiusvis hominis est errare, nullius nisi insipientis in errore perseverare.

Offline Viper

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RE: Match #2--Scoring Question
« Reply #44 on: February 14, 2009, 05:11:23 AM »




Okay....dumb question here...maybe.
In scoring, when you hit a ring do you count the higher or lower number. The reason I ask, I might have added up my score on the low side.





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Gamo Viper W/Leapers 3-9X40, GTR III, soundproofed stock. Need Turbo-Tune:(