Author Topic: NEW.... economy air rifle  (Read 5842 times)

Offline kp4att

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NEW.... economy air rifle
« on: January 20, 2010, 07:00:06 AM »
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GERALD (KP4-ATT): PUERTO RICO ISLAND!!!
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(Feb 3, 2010)
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Offline RedFeather

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RE: NEW.... economy air rifle
« Reply #1 on: January 22, 2010, 11:22:47 AM »
Check out the Blog. The modern day Diana 27 it ain't!!! This Mendoza has no oil hole, so he recommends adding a drop or two through the transfer port "like on most break barrel springers". Poof! If you really want one that badly, go for it. Being a Diana fan, especially of the "classics" like the 27, I was a bit PO'd. I'll bet he's never even handled a 27. As I posted there, the Slavia 634 was about as close as you could come to one of those. And, at $125, there are better rifles out there.

Offline longislandhunter

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RE: NEW.... economy air rifle
« Reply #2 on: January 22, 2010, 11:46:43 AM »
Strange looking little rifle,,,, will be interesting to see how it sells.  

Jeff
\"If it was easy it wouldn\'t be hunting, it would be shopping.\"

Offline pindog2000

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RE: NEW.... economy air rifle
« Reply #3 on: January 22, 2010, 12:29:40 PM »
its a mendoza probally diesels like crazy oh no no no.
keep your eyes on the prize & dont let it crawl away.

Offline joek

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Re: NEW.... economy air rifle
« Reply #4 on: January 22, 2010, 12:32:30 PM »
interesting trigger, considered it but checked on the mexican forum to see if mendoza had improved any, seems like they have gotten worse
fwiw joe

In the meantime....I\'m cleaning my gun...

Offline davee1

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Re: NEW.... economy air rifle
« Reply #5 on: January 23, 2010, 04:43:42 AM »
Joe...I never did like the Mendoza trigger. I've got one on my X2switchbarrel. I guess one gets used to it, but taking it apart is a real pain, and I've been tinkering in airguns for a few years now. Theres some little and long springs that just suck. It just aint natural.
Walther Falcon.25, Shadow.177, Shadow Express.22, Whisper.22, CFX.177/.22, B3AK.22, B3.177(x2), B4.22, B21.22, B26.22, Diana350M.177/.22, Beeman1073.177/.22, Hammerli Storm.22, Hammerli X2.177/.22, BeemanP1.177, P3.177, P17.177(x2), Diana5G(P5).177, Diana LP8, Browning800, BenjiHB22, Crosman1377, Marauder.22

Offline bnations

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A bit touchy tonight?
« Reply #6 on: January 24, 2010, 02:26:15 PM »
"I'll bet he's never even handled a 27"

Um, you might want to rethink that statement in light of the many times that Tom has posted about the Diana 27.  It seems to be one of his more favorite models.  In fact, the did a 10 part series specifically dedicated to the 27 including how to assemble/disassemble the ball-bearing trigger unit.

http://www.pyramydair.com/blog/2009/05/diana-27-part-10.html

What's your beef is with the oil hole or lack thereof?  It seems pretty logical that if there isn't an oil hole and you need to get some lubricant (oil or silicone) in front of the piston, then you have to add it via the transfer port.  IIRC, the older models with leather piston seals required periodic oiling.  Even synthetic sealed guns can benefit from some silicone down the gullet if they're dieseling heavily.

Offline RedFeather

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RE: A bit touchy tonight?
« Reply #7 on: January 24, 2010, 04:25:03 PM »


To compare this rifle to the older Diana's like the 27 is really stretching. For someone with extensive experience with a 27 to say the Bronco is a latter-day replacement, well, they should know better. Don't care if they've published 100 part blogs, either. As to the oiling hole, the larger Mendozas are designed to diesel by application of oil into a hole where it soaks into a fiber washer on the piston. I'm willing to bet that this gun lacks that hole simply because it is not intended to diesel. Likely the lack of one was mentioned for those familiar with Mendozas. Why add oil in through the transfer port and who says that is standard operating procedure for synthetic sealed guns these days? A few still do but not most. It's that kind of thing that sort of got me with this review.



There are some guys who have had a lot of experience with air guns and go way back in the sport. It doesn't always make them right. Sometimes the Emperor is naked.


Offline bnations

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RE: A bit touchy tonight?
« Reply #8 on: January 25, 2010, 02:47:37 AM »
Red,

Have you actually handled one of the Broncos?  If not, it might make sense to hold off on opinionating until you do.  If you have, then accept my apologies in advance.  But, I'm looking forward to someone else reviewing the Bronco to get another person's opinion.  I've been tempted a number of times by the Mendoza double trigger blade but have always held off for one reason or another, funds mostly.  Frankly, the fiber washer worries me though reports are that once the factory lubes combust away the guns really settle down into nice shooters.  So, I'm pulling for them as competition helps the customer :-)

I've never had the pleasure of seeing or shooting a 27, so I'm only going on what everyone else says about it being a delightful gun.  It's on the bucket list for sure.  What is it that you like so much about the old model 27 rifles?

Why add oil?  Well, on the old guns with leather seals you have to give them a few drops on occasion to keep the seal pliable.  Lacking an oiling hole, you have to add it through the transfer port.  So, there's more than a little precedent for telling folks to add oil to their gun.  This isn't really needed for a gun with a synthetic piston seal, obviously, though many folks will recommend some silicone oil to calm a heavy dieseling gun down.   I say silicone, but really anything with a high enough flash point will work, in theory.  Heck, I believe that many of the owner's manuals still recommend this procedure leather or synthetic.  The Mendoza oil hole is noted in many reviews because it simplifies this maintenance step, which speaks to a company that pays attention to the customer's needs.

Offline bnations

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I think he was telling you NOT to oil it
« Reply #9 on: January 25, 2010, 02:58:37 AM »
Here's the relevant portion on oiling or not oiling from part 1 of his blog:

"Another Pyramyd Air employee joined Paul in reminding me about the over-oiling problem many Mendozas have. Here was a chance to do away with that dastardly oil hole on the left side of the spring tube. If the gun needs oil, and they seldom ever do, then put a drop down the transfer port hole, the same as every other spring rifle on the market."

It seems to me that he had them remove the oiling port as a way to prevent people from adding oil to the powerplant.  He even goes so far as to refer to this as a known problem with the  Mendoza line of guns, probably in reference to their seemingly designed-to-diesel reputation.  A reputation that is apparently well-earned.  That hardly seems unreasonable to me.  He even says that guns seldom ever need it.  He leaves an interesting comment in the second report about discussions that they had with Mendoza about this very issue with indications that Mendoza may change their policies regarding oiling if the Bronco succeeds.

BTW, the Mendoza owner's manuals (c.f. the RM-2000 manual, section 7)  say to add silicone based oil every 2000 shots (as do other brands' manuals though they seem to differ as to the proper frequency).  Tom seems to be advocating away from doing so by asking for the oil hole to be removed from the Bronco.  I can't help but think that you and he are on the same side of this oiling versus not oiling thing.

Offline Tpatner412

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Re: NEW.... economy air rifle
« Reply #10 on: January 25, 2010, 03:43:19 AM »
It will definitely be interesting to see how this sells and preforms.  I know Tom is a big fan of the plinking spring gun after listening to his Podcasts but I'm not sure how appealing this gun will really be to the general public seeing as both Crosman and Gamo have two youth models that shoot at similar speeds to the Bronco.  Maybe the size of the rifle is different?  I guess we'll just have to wait and see
\"Mess with the best, die like the rest.\"

Offline RedFeather

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RE: I think he was telling you NOT to oil it
« Reply #11 on: January 25, 2010, 04:06:39 AM »


He did say in a blog comment he did not mean petroleum based oil. What I was saying is this gun doesn't seem to be designed in the same way as the 2000/600 series. Perhaps Mendoza does not even include it on their lower powered guns where the additional dieseling would be less "beneficial".



Yeah, maybe I got "too cranky" over this. For those who are unfamiliar with Diana guns of the 27's vintage, go on the American Vintage Airgun forum and search for it. You might be surprised at what an "entry level" gun looked like in those days. Alas, who can gainsay the gods?


Offline RedFeather

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Re: NEW.... economy air rifle
« Reply #12 on: January 25, 2010, 06:24:57 AM »
Yeah, no more comments on it from me. What surprises me is that he didn't compare it more to the Diana 24 or the new Shutze. Of course, the Schutze sells for about $200 or $75 more and does not have an adjustable trigger. It the sights are anything like my T04 24's, they are very good, though. Guess the public will have the final say.

Offline Tpatner412

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Re: NEW.... economy air rifle
« Reply #13 on: January 31, 2010, 07:24:51 AM »
See how it preforms in this review.  It sure looks like a great shooting rifle to me.

http://www.youtube.com/user/AirGunWeb#p/u/1/2RKSSd7RoJQ

\"Mess with the best, die like the rest.\"

Offline RedFeather

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Re: NEW.... economy air rifle
« Reply #14 on: January 31, 2010, 06:12:47 PM »
Did watch it. Skipped the kid's testimonial. Looks to be pretty accurate but certainly a lot slower than even a 24. Guy could use some eye protection, too, FWIW. He was honest in his appraisal, though.