Shoot heavy pellets in a .177 spring gun

[SUPERFITTER]

Will someone explain to me the reason that you should not shoot heavy pellets (10.5gr) in a .177 spring gun when I can shoot a light pellet (11.9gr) in a .22 spring gun that uses the same power plant in several calibers? Are the springs different?
Example:  Crosman Quest 800X vs. Crosman Quest 1000

Thanks

[Tpatner412]

The problem with shooting heavy pellets in a spring gun is that it places too much stress on the spring.  The problem with shooting pellets that are too light, for example PBA raptors, is that the lack of weight of the pellets creates a similar action to dry firing the rifle.  The pellets are so light that by using them damage is being done to the spring.  I am not sure about the spring difference question although I would imagine that there is some kind of thickness or length difference between calibers.

[howie1a]

Their is no difference in 177 or 22 cal power plants for example the Beeman with changable barrels the only difference is the bore dia. Howie

[Mark 611]

Enjoy your rifle and shoot any pellet weight you feel comfortable with shooting springs and seals are a maintenance items in spring guns thier not hard to replace don't get caught up in the hype to light of pellets will hurt your rifle but don't worrie to much about the 10.5's!

[Graham]

They've just released some pellets here in the UK called ThUnderBOLTs (that's how it's written). They're made of zinc, and the .22 weighs in at 10.2grns and .177 at 5grns. These seem far too light to me. By the way the strange way the name is written is a reference to Usain Bolt, 'cos they're supposed to fly FAST. Yeah right..

[Mark 611]

yes I agree with you on this one I think these would be to light for use in a rifle but may work well in a pistol!

[BWANA]

I've wondered the same thing. I own both guns and have used the 10.5gr in the Quest 1000. I did break the spring, but then I have broken the spring in all of my guns, at least once, until I tuned them and lubed them properly. The Crosman Quest 800 calls for spring  part # B19-00-4A for the .177 and #B18-00-4D for the .22 version. The B18-00-4D is the same spring used in the Quest 1000. I've replaced the spring in my Quest 800, .22, with the B19-00-4A (800 fps). It gives me a smoother shooting cycle and still plenty of power for rabbits out to 30 yards. Like another poster said, shoot what you want and order an extra spring and seal from Crosman, in case you need them. Spring is $5.70 and the seal is $3.60, plus $4 shipping. Happy Easter to everyone. Safe shooting.

[ezman604]

Okay, gonna throw MHO in here on this one. I'm by no means an expert but I take the word of those that are. I enjoy working on my AGs but enjoy shooting them MORE. I'd rather not cause maintenance or put stress on my equipment. I want them to perform and to do so for a LONG time. The right pellet chose is a MUST. Too light of a round, as mentioned, will not produce enough resistance when fired and will cause the piston to slam in the chamber. That can cause the spring to break or damage the seals. Even though they may be maintenance items, HOW long of an interval between relacement? 50 shots or 5,000? I prefer 5,000 or more. Check out this articleby The Pelletier Tom Gaylord. HERE[/b][/i]

On the other end of the spectrum, a too heavy pellet will also put stress on the internals and cause unnecessary low life expectancy.

There's other considerations too. Going super sonic will cause a pellet to tumbledown range. This will cause a loss of accuracy. The recommendation of the experts and service professionls is to shoot a variety of pellets in the middle weight rangeto find the round with the most accuracy. Stay away fom the HYPED alloy rounds and the extra heavy rounds (in a springer) to keep your springer shooting the best for the longest. I'll also throw in that most of this is irrelivant with a PCP gun. The only hype is the fps a manufacturer boasts their gun will make with these rounds. Yeah, they may make that velosity but for how long? And how accurate? Personally, I'drather have a very accurate gun that lasts a long troublefree time.

Again, just MHO. Let the discussion begin.

Happy Shooting!!!!

Dave

[Rickster]

CDT recommends not going above 9gr in a .177 and 15 in .22 Steel springer.
It doesn't matter for Gas-Rams.

Rick

[pindog2000]

In all my .177s which ain't a whole lot except for the ruger I keep my pellets under 10 grains and I don't fool with the light pellets the 5 grainers the ruger I will shoot 177 ultras which are 10.9 grains and the gamo rockets which are 9 or10 grainers I think the 22 cals which I have plenty of shoot no higher than 16 grains which some of the heavy jsbs are in some last post I sold a couple of heavy pellets and some pellets that weren't cutting it most I sold were too heavy for what I need I agree I'm not a tuner so I need my springs to last a while now with pcps since there compressed air I assume heavier is better or even with the gas ram but springers that's a no no good luck on what ever you do

[Mark 611]

The use of pellet weights depends on what you intend to use the pellet for? if your gonna use the rifle to just punch paper you probly only need a medium weight pellet, if your gonna hunt I personaly will not sacrafice the knock down power of a heaver pellet, example a .177cal I would use  10.5gr pellet on a pegion sized bird at any distance cause not all shot angles are gonna be perfect and if a side shot is all you can take a lighter pellet alot of times will not do the job where as the heavier pellet will knock'em dead 99% of the time, just my experience I shoot alot of piegons.

[tjk]

I think Dave (EZman) hit it right on. I will add that heavier pellets are best left to real magnum springers and not your typical 1000 rated rifles like the gamo/crosman B-18s and so forth.  Heavy pellets work best in rifles such as the Diana 350/460/48/52/54 or their chinese clones.  As for knock down power, I don't really think its going to make that much of a difference to a squirrels head inside 40 yards,...light or heavy. Nor will you really gain that much more energy down range. My advice, is to stay at 8.8 or less for standard 1000 fps rifles. JMHO, tjk

[kiwi]

Ok guys lets look past the simplistic stuff...
2 pellets same weight one .177 other .22..
witha  piston being pushed by air or liquid  the resisstance
that piston has depends on the surface area of the piston
 ""piston is the pellet in this case"

heavy .177 pellet small surface area...
same weight .22 pellet larger surface area....

AREA / PRESSURE / RESISTANCE / POWER

So a heavy .177 pellet forms a very high pressure air
zone for the spring / piston to bonce off...a very lesser version of a dry fire efect..
but it happens every time you fire with a heavy pellet...over & over

its all the same as pnumatic / Hydrulic engineering...

Just my take on it.....

Pete

[kiwi]

kiwi - 4/5/2010  5:4

Ok guys lets look past the simplistic stuff...
2 pellets same weight one .177 other .22..
witha  piston being pushed by air or liquid  the resisstance
that piston has depends on the surface area of the piston
 ""piston is the pellet in this case"

heavy .177 pellet small surface area...
same weight .22 pellet larger surface area....

AREA / PRESSURE / RESISTANCE / POWER

So a heavy .177 pellet forms a very high pressure air
zone for the spring / piston to bonce off...a very lesser version of a dry fire efect..
but it happens every time you fire with a heavy pellet...over & over

its all the same as pnumatic / Hydrulic engineering...

Just my take on it.....

Pete

Bugger opssss

[SUPERFITTER]

Thanks for all the replies.
Bwana any idea how many pellets it took to break the spring in your Quest?
 
I’m using H&N Barracuda 10.65gr pellets. They shoot great at 50feet in my basement range. The lighter pellets shot a pattern and not a nice group like the H&N’s. I guess I will have to built a spring compressor when the time comes to replace the spring and seal.

Pete I like your theory; I don’t have any .22 pellets to compare lengths with the .177. The .22 could have been the same weight but with a longer thinner skirt to get the same length as the .177. The area of the .22 is larger but the surface area touching the barrel would have been also greater.