Bench rest R9 shoots great, unless I touch it!

[wahoowad]

I've been punching holes in paper lately with my stock .20 R9. I have been getting progressively better by focusing on my breathing, trigger hold, etc. but mostly by better supporting the rifle on my bag rests. Yesterday I was shooting dime groups at 20 yards (which is good for me) but to do it I had to barely hold the rifle and mostly let it be supported by the bags on the barrel and stock. I barely had any grip back by the trigger, barely had my shoulder touching, barely had my cheeck touching. I mean super light, the bags were doing all the work, not me! The tiniest change to any of that would produce a flier of a 1/2" or more. Even an artillery hold would be far more holding pressure on the gun (shoulder, trigger hand) so how do I ever get away from letting the gun lay in the bags and allow me to hold it? I think I'm finally seeing what hold sensitivity means but feel powerless to do anything about it.

Gun is stock, feels twangy. How much of the above would a tune remove?

[daved]

No way to tell without trying it.  Wouldn't even say for sure it would help at all.  Springers are well known for NOT shooting well benched, but yours sounds weird.  My R9 .177 GF shot okay benched when stock, but was really buzzy.  I dropped a JM kit in it yesterday (I'd already deburred, lubed, and replaced the piston seal), and was shooting 1/2" groups at 35 yards with FTT's.  That was holding the rifle to my shoulder, and the forearm on a rest.  A fairly firm hold was actually giving me the best results.  Nice dead blow shot cycle, and no more buzz.

Two suggestions, make sure the forearm can slip on the front rest, and lose the rear rest, try holding it yourself.  If all you ever intend to do is shoot bench rest, then your current technique is fine.  But if not, you need to come up with a technique that you can replicate in the field.  I shoot the way I do from a bench, because I can shoot in a similar fashion off the bench, either by using an improvised front rest, or even kneeling and supporting my left arm on my knee.  Groups will open up, of course, but it's still plenty accurate enough for hunting.  

BTW, I passed on buying an R9 several years back because of their reputation for being hold sensitive.  Based on my rifle, I'd have to say that reputation is over blown.  I recently went back to springers after shooting nothing but PCP's for almost 3 years, and I've had no problems that I'd characterize as hold sensitivity.  Now, all 4 of the rifles I have are tuned by me, two with Vortek kits, and two with JM parts.  All of which is my long winded way of saying you can't go wrong getting your R9 tuned.  Good luck.

Dave

[Mark 611]

ya daved I was gonna say the same thing, tuning the gun and a good breakin period does wonders for some fussy AG's

[wahoowad]

I am only able to achieve decent groups and especially consistency by relying heavily on the rests. I would prefer to do as you say and just use the forearm rest but then I had such erratic performance that I didn't know what was at fault (me, hold, pellet, scope, etc.). I think this has been helpful for me to baseline the gun to see that it can shoot but now I have to work back out of that crutch. Right now I try to hold it more and I start getting different groups like the scope has moved or something. I'd like to have it shoot a particular pattern one day and be able to closely replicate it then next time I shoot.

[leftcoast1]

Check all the stock screws and make sure they are tight. Check your lock up make sure there is no slop. When I shoot benched I use a front bag but, one that is almost flat on top. Then I rest the rifle on the bag between the trigger guard and the rear of the cocking slot. Clean the barrel good and find its favorite pellet. Even a self tune with JM kit will change the rifles performance. Let us know.

[daved]

Leftcoast made a good point, make sure all the screws are tight.  Couple of things I forgot to ask earlier.  Is this rifle new?  Beeman/HW guns are just the opposite of Diana's, they usually ship way over lubed, and frequently with lube in front of the piston seal.  Typical break in period with any springer is 500-1000 shots, and they can be pretty erratic in the meantime.  Excess lube won't help, and if it's bad enough, you can burn a piston seal.  If that's happened, it'll never shoot right without a new seal.

The other question is, what pellets are you using?  Although not a magnum, the R9 has a pretty stout spring in it, and won't do well with light weight pellets.  If you haven't tried them yet, get some heavy weights, something like a Kodiak/Barracuda, and shoot a few, like maybe a dozen or so.  It could help burn off any excess lube, and speed up the break in.

Last question, do you have a chrony or access to one?  Large velocity fluctuations could cause similar symptoms, and could indicate a broken or damaged spring, a bad breech seal, or a burned/damaged piston seal.  Hope something here is helpful, and good luck.  Later.

Dave

[wahoowad]

Dave,

I probably have been shooting lighter pellets in general although lately have been shooting heavier JSB Exacts 13.5 gr. I'll pay closer attention to pellet weight and performance. I do have a good mixture to try. Gun has maybe 500 rounds through it. And yes, I just got a chrony so will be using that a lot over the next week or so. I think I shot some Beeman Crow Magnums 12.8 gr around 700 fps. Will do more testing with this.